On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 1:15 PM, Lee Douglas <leerevdouglas@gmail.com> wrote:
I think it takes calamity to get humanity to all be reading the same
page. The question remians how much calamity does it require?
> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 11:22 AM, Lee Douglas <leerevdoug...@gmail.com>wrote:
On Aug 30, 11:51 am, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It doesn't matter how many people agree or disagree on which paper or idea.
> That's why I don't share the hope for a change of world view. One exchanges
> world views, that's how it works.
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text ->
>
>
> > Hahah Neil a grand plan but one that stands not a chance I think.
>
> > How does one fight agianst ignorance except throught teaching?
>
> > But of course some wont be taught, some cannot be taught, some will
> > reble against teachings not similar to their own belifes of
> > knowledege.
>
> > In short the capacity for reason in us humans are not the same from
> > individual to individual. All ideas are bound to attract followers
> > and disenters, that is just the way it is and I do not see any
> > evidance that it will quickly change.
>
> > What will happen when these protocols are found, and only three people
> > agree to them?
>
> > On Aug 27, 9:46 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I was thinking more about how we could identify ignorance in reaction
> > > to see if we could find ways of putting it right in ways argument
> > > doesn't unless you are open to a change of world view. We somehow
> > > need the world-view protocols attached to what is said to know what is
> > > being argued or decided. One can spot consensus protocols in
> > > cockroaches so why not in humans? They may act to kill dialogue.
>
> > > On Aug 25, 6:57 am, paradox <eadohe...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Perhaps with a long enough view and a wide enough perspective, Molly,
> > > > its perhaps not so much the emergence of a new order but a changing of
> > > > the guard.
>
> > > > On Aug 20, 1:51 pm, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > Creating order from chaos requires entering into the chaos. We are
> > > > > often too content to rest in outdated but comfortable social orders.
> > > > > The balance of individual and consensus reality becomes infinite in
> > > > > mutual creativity. Finding and maintaining that point in experience
> > > > > is a real challenge. Once found, old orders fall away, new orders
> > are
> > > > > created, the circles of familiarity become smaller and at the same
> > > > > time eternal as folks capable of sharing the unseen unite in action.
> > > > > Rome burns, and a new order emerges. Yet all we can see or feel is
> > > > > Rome burning. Why?
>
> > > > > On Aug 20, 2:57 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >http://www.economist.com/blogs/bagehot/2011/08/civil-disorder-and-loo...
>
> > > > > > We had riots in England a couple of weeks ago. Our media was full
> > of
> > > > > > people, including reporters, stating this was a new issue and
> > > > > > unprecedented. I did not believe this as I watched - though I did
> > see
> > > > > > a great deal I recognised from GTA games. The above link to the
> > > > > > Economist makes use of a book by Pearson I read years ago - it
> > casts a
> > > > > > very different view that our riots were really only history
> > repeating
> > > > > > itself.
>
> > > > > > I don't believe human thought can 'rid itself' of emotional
> > response
> > > > > > (or should). I do believe we can do better than 'knee-jerk
> > reactions'
> > > > > > - but I also believe this is quite difficult and beyond many people
> > > > > > left to their own devices. I believe our democracies are weak at
> > the
> > > > > > moment and that this is because we can't argue very well - hence
> > > > > > politicians appeal to much that is populist and wrong using highly
> > > > > > dubious techniques.
>
> > > > > > I'm sure I could identify the protocols that appeal to 'ignorant
> > > > > > Idols' that lead to situations of 'nopolitics' in our societies and
> > > > > > thus the rule of the very rich through "economics" in a way far
> > more
> > > > > > centralised than any politburo.
>
> > > > > > I've pretty much given up on democracy. Teaching is very
> > frustrating
> > > > > > because you want to encourage self-learning and resourceful human
> > > > > > beings and also know this is too much for most - democracy is
> > > > > > similar. The struggle is knowing this and not wanting to be
> > elitist
> > > > > > and sneer at others. I succeed a bit in 'adventures with ideas'
> > but
> > > > > > the same mistakes in reaction crop up time and time and time again
> > in
> > > > > > wider social action.
>
> > > > > > I wonder if outing the protocols of the dreary positions people
> > take
> > > > > > in reaction could help us actually find dialogue?- Hide quoted text
> > -
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