objectivity gets as invasive as bully-power if we aren't careful.
On Oct 17, 2:27 pm, James Lynch <ashkas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Personal power seems part and parcel to living authentically (whatever
> that might mean), motive and intent buried in the basis of authority.
> I take your meaning is that there are a few deeply rooted memes for a
> weak basis on authority, and it makes me wonder about how we assess a
> disproportionate amount of authority on achievement and how this gets
> corrupted by the apparent values celebrated in our society. Is this in
> dissonance with nature, I wonder, or are we as mesmerized by it as the
> bird or fish to a shiny object. I'm trying to scrap out a few
> paragraphs here and there on rhetoric and writing to get a grasp of my
> own, hopefully it will light a fire under my pen. An act of futility
> perhaps..
>
> On 10/15/11, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
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> > I don't think we are all stuck. Certainly there are many memes that
> > are, and many that are not. Spiral Dynamics is a good model that
> > allows us to understand the states and stages of humanity, and how we
> > each spiral up and down them in our lifetime. Someone who can't see
> > past their ethnocentric or egocentric view will play the power card.
>
> > On Oct 14, 10:42 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I once lived amongst mice - it was a university psychology thingy. I
> >> first wondered why the subordinate mice didn't overthrow the king
> >> mouse and he (he was always male) always kept his crew in vicious
> >> check ans "poverty". I knew the underling males could be trained and
> >> fed to defeat him. Later I just saw that nothing changed except the
> >> identity of the king mouse. I grew to quite like individual mice but
> >> not the mouse society.
> >> Currently, though we have an extensive understanding of genetic-
> >> environment-evolution stuff - sufficient at least to make most nature-
> >> nurture debate old hat - we are still stuck in a misunderstanding of
> >> our animal situation and in dire myths that hide the nature of motives
> >> even from those who lay claim to extirpate ideology. One wants to
> >> live and let live, yet this is never enough. We need 'power' of some
> >> kind to negate power itself - or fatalism.
>
> >> On Oct 14, 2:03 pm, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > Though motives can work themselves into a snarl- like yarn or string-
> >> > and one often needs time (maturity and education) to follow the path
> >> > backwards. (The Labyrinth myth comes to mind.)
>
> >> > On Oct 14, 1:36 am, RP Singh <123...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > Man is bound by God through genetics , environment etc. , but all of
> >> > > it so hidden that to an individual he is absolutely free , and free he
> >> > > is as he is the agent , it is he who decides and acts and as such the
> >> > > bonds beings so subtle as to be unconscious , he is consciously doing
> >> > > everything freely.If we can be aware of our real motives we can
> >> > > control our actions to some degree and it is in that way that
> >> > > knowledge of our hidden motives can help us.
>
> >> > > On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 11:41 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > > I like the theme RP - but what of being 'bound' by
> >> > > > genetics/evolution/
> >> > > > environment - which gives some clues on how to escape through
> >> > > > knowledge?
>
> >> > > > On Oct 13, 4:30 pm, RP Singh <123...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > >> It is God who binds you and not you yourself , and so you are
> >> > > >> accountable to yourself and society , but not to God. In this world
> >> > > >> you are doing everything freely , but in God's presence you are
> >> > > >> just a
> >> > > >> puppet. If I am bound to err , it doesn't absolve me of the action
> >> > > >> as
> >> > > >> it has been done by me , and if you hurt me , again you are
> >> > > >> accountable for it as it is done by you. It is only in God's
> >> > > >> presence
> >> > > >> that you are innocent as you are a puppet in his hand , but in
> >> > > >> man's
> >> > > >> world you are accountable and responsible for every action unless
> >> > > >> society frees you of that responsibility on the grounds of insanity
> >> > > >> on
> >> > > >> your part. You are always the agent and as such always responsible
> >> > > >> for
> >> > > >> your every action and inaction.
>
> >> > > >> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 8:36 PM, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > >> > When everything is predetermined... and if we all accept that as
> >> > > >> > fact... accountability is without meaning !
>
> >> > > >> > Accountability has a meaning when I have a choice in the matter,
> >> > > >> > and
> >> > > >> > if I am aware of that personal freedom.
>
> >> > > >> > On Oct 13, 7:46 pm, RP Singh <123...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > >> >> When everything is predetermined , the obvious truth that it is
> >> > > >> >> man
> >> > > >> >> who is acting , makes man accountable to man and society and
> >> > > >> >> not to
> >> > > >> >> God.
>
> >> > > >> >> On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 8:10 PM, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com>
> >> > > >> >> wrote:
> >> > > >> >> > But I couldn't see the rational thread between the "God
> >> > > >> >> > alone..."
> >> > > >> >> > premise and its "Man alone..." derivative !
>
> >> > > >> >> > On Oct 13, 7:20 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > >> >> >> I rather like the idea RP, of the corollary.
>
> >> > > >> >> >> On Oct 13, 3:02 pm, RP Singh <123...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > >> >> >> > AS everything good and evil is done by God's dictates and
> >> > > >> >> >> > everything
> >> > > >> >> >> > that a man endures is from God's pleasure , the corollary
> >> > > >> >> >> > follows --
> >> > > >> >> >> > whatever a man does , he is free to do and accountable to
> >> > > >> >> >> > man and
> >> > > >> >> >> > society.- Hide quoted text -
>
> >> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> --
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