Re: Mind's Eye Re: deep thought

Our senses lead us to understanding the wider world; they expand our
thoughts and understanding and can lead us to a virtuous life however
some never get beyond. This is an ancient thought when the stars and
heaven were sacred and man was a creature within Nature rather than
outside of it attempting to control Nature. (Not sure the world holds
a virtuous life in high esteem, however.)

On May 15, 11:30 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think you are very right James external stimulus has always helped me and
> I enjoy it very much..
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 3:56 PM, James <ashkas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > That may be true of us all in the sense that the process of learning is
> > undertaken within each in unique ways, the external stimulus is valuable in
> > facilitating or motivating the inner. Taking part in that process as
> > facilitator to me represents the height of learning. It hit me that I was
> > wrong about something, I look to the trees for guidance at times, it is
> > fascinating how a single breath for them is what we call one day, it
> > reminds me that I am not a machine and need to breathe life deeply.
> > Whatever that means. :)
>
> > Thank you and others for the valuable and thoughtful responses, some
> > especially who are waiting patiently while I seem to drop a bomb then
> > disappear. I very much value the process and see it here frequently in
> > diverse ways.
>
> > Best foot forward as they say, and godspeed to us all. I'm rushing here,
> > so much to do! :)
>
> > On 5/15/2013 7:59 AM, Molly wrote:
>
> >> In response to James' inquiry about understanding himself as he
> >> observes his own process - intuition first - it seems you are your own
> >> best authority, James.
>
> >> On May 14, 9:44 pm, rigs <rigs...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> You would argue with Aristotle, I presume. Hierarchy exists for a
> >>> reason.
>
> >>> You might be interested in an article on John le Carre (I think his
> >>> real name is David Cornwall) which appeared recently on the BBC site.
> >>> Sigh...at 81 he is still a dreamboat- and that's just his photo! He
> >>> has some more to write about- the demonization of Islam.
>
> >>> On May 14, 9:27 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>  I've found reading and writing more or less impossible for about 10
> >>>> years now - this may seem odd as I do a lot of both.  More or less
> >>>> nothing comes without baggage I don't want and, of course, nothing
> >>>> survives the deconstruction of science or serious history.  I know I
> >>>> don't really want much more than a few friends and security - but even
> >>>> this is to want a radically different society.  Words are so
> >>>> difficult.  Religion is a very difficult example.  I'm not against
> >>>> what Molly or Gabby or Don do with it in their different ways - but it
> >>>> remains a control fraud in my world-view.  Old stories in academe have
> >>>> the congregation as undergraduates, the sermon deliverers as masters
> >>>> and PhDs and researchers as the content and truth producers.
> >>>> Hierarchy is a religious term in origin.  I'm revolted, less by the
> >>>> thought of this fiction, than the ease with which many swallow it.
> >>>> There is a spiral dynamic at work - we used to consider such in terms
> >>>> of RSVP cycles or an orchestra practising - you sort of (mostly) are
> >>>> never starting at the beginning but join in the cycle.  A colleague
> >>>> did a PhD on the children's writer Enid Blyton - fair enough - one can
> >>>> investigate anything.  I have no problem with this in-itself.  The
> >>>> model sadly extends to
> >>>>   a great deal of teaching in which the fictional nature of text-made-
> >>>> basic is elided.  I doubt you know more management and economics after
> >>>> spending time with business school books, than you would after reading
> >>>> a few decent novels.  A contradiction in all non-science learning
> >>>> concerns making texts into Idols to worship.
> >>>> Science only takes us so far and at heart is not very philosophical.
> >>>> I favour gardening and cooking analogies - the 'theory' has been
> >>>> called tropical fish realism.  I follow advice from science books much
> >>>> as I follow gardening and cooking books - and think here, given
> >>>> equality of kitchen materials and food - whether we'd choose to eat my
> >>>> cooking or rigs'!  Skill factors not always in the books and
> >>>> experiential learning are important.  I spend time reading really
> >>>> complex stuff on the history of science - mostly German work of late
> >>>> and I'm not at all sure I understand better without the translation.
> >>>> My story of science starts in approximation by creatures of gravity in
> >>>> co-evolution - but gravity remains a label.  This is some way from
> >>>> growing plants with recommended amounts of fertiliser, nematode
> >>>> biological warfare against slugs and strict instruction against
> >>>> digging in my raised beds to the cats and dog.
> >>>> Our cats all strayed in at some time and we have a male ginger that
> >>>> still doesn't trust me (one wonders on the poor thing's past trauma).
> >>>> On May 13, 11:46 pm, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>> Not quite sure of your focus James.  In terns of models, I like Spiral
> >>>>> Dynamics.  It allows the recognition and inclusion of everyone in
> >>>>> their own terms.
> >>>>> On May 12, 11:19 pm, James <ashkas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>>> You have a rapt audience Molly, I have many questions. I would be very
> >>>>>> interested in information regarding child developmental psychology and
> >>>>>> any individuals who have a story of their experiences and reflections
> >>>>>> written. I understand there are many types of people out there and I
> >>>>>> didn't think there was a word for it at all other than 'freak'. If you
> >>>>>> have knowledge on this I can't express how valuable some would find
> >>>>>> it.
> >>>>>> Do any of them feel like a 'pool of reflection'? Sensitivity to lying
> >>>>>> and deceit? Is there any norm, parallels with autism, can they freely
> >>>>>> dissociate (as in the complex, but the book is useless in this
> >>>>>> instance)? Any statistical research out there, or terms I can use to
> >>>>>> find more? Spare nothing please, I will cripple google with the fury
> >>>>>> of
> >>>>>> my searches on your every word.
> >>>>>> On 5/12/2013 9:30 AM, Allan H wrote:
>
> >>>>>>> I agree with you Molly
> >>>>>>> On Sun, May 12, 2013 at 2:53 PM, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com
> >>>>>>> <mailto:mollyb...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>      " I seem to learn in reverse starting with an
> >>>>>>>      intuitive bond but I'm no genius just weird"
> >>>>>>>      IMHO being in-tune with the unseen (or infinite) is a
> >>>>>>> particularly
> >>>>>>>      sensitive and rare form of perception.  I am always surprised
> >>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>      delighted to find such a person.  Listening to our instincts and
> >>>>>>>      intuitions first, and allowing the material world to validate
> >>>>>>>      naturally is living life inside out.
> >>>>>>>      On May 11, 11:59 pm, James <ashkas...@gmail.com
> >>>>>>>      <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>      > Glad you said it Allan, my enthusiasm told me to leave the box
> >>>>>>>      alone. I
> >>>>>>>      > think the term 'unknown commodity' fits, and there are some
> >>>>>>> strange
> >>>>>>>      > varieties out there as I've known at least one, others are
> >>>>>>>      suspect but
> >>>>>>>      > as I can see how they would be driven nuts I won't be out
> >>>>>>> there
> >>>>>>>      > interviewing. The curiosity crosses my mind at times on the
> >>>>>>> rare
> >>>>>>>      > occasion that I catch the news of whether someone was just
> >>>>>>>      another dumb
> >>>>>>>      > nut or did we just lose another potential major asset to
> >>>>>>>      civilization.
> >>>>>>>      > Yes, if we worked to meet the needs of all without exception,
> >>>>>>> I said
> >>>>>>>      > this exact thing to someone regarding cultural integration the
> >>>>>>>      other day
> >>>>>>>      > in regards to our cultural isolation. An ounce of
> >>>>>>> prevention.. a
> >>>>>>>      pound
> >>>>>>>      > of agression. It isn't even in the common vernacular I'm
> >>>>>>> afraid.
> >>>>>>>      > I am at a loss for meaning to your last sentence my instincts
> >>>>>>>      throw up
> >>>>>>>      > red flags on the subject. A few times I've been able to
> >>>>>>> approach the
> >>>>>>>      > subject by reassociating an external self to see things as a
> >>>>>>>      story that
> >>>>>>>      > I was free to speak the truth of and pursue compassion and say
> >>>>>>>      'Im so
> >>>>>>>      > sorry that...', as an older person would say to a child. It's
> >>>>>>> still
> >>>>>>>      > blank though, push some more and blank to freeze (it's good to
> >>>>>>>      know the
> >>>>>>>      > physiological effects of stress disorders there), push more
> >>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>      it's  .
> >>>>>>>      > morning shits and shakes for a few plus temporary immune
> >>>>>>> system
> >>>>>>>      > shutdown. There are a variety of mental disciplines,
> >>>>>>> meditative
> >>>>>>>      > techniques, insights into my nature, and preventive
> >>>>>>> disciplines
> >>>>>>>      that can
> >>>>>>>      > be derived from experiences but I can't tell him 'you deserve
> >>>>>>>      better'
> >>>>>>>      > because it's relevance ends as a gesture. The process is
> >>>>>>>      intuitive with
> >>>>>>>      > others, a born talent, I seem to learn in reverse starting
> >>>>>>> with an
> >>>>>>>      > intuitive bond but I'm no genius just weird. ;-) My sense of
> >>>>>>>      humor is
> >>>>>>>      > improving though, not being understood is so damn BORING, it's
> >>>>>>>      enough to
> >>>>>>>      > make a person develop ADHD.
> >>>>>>>      > On 5/11/2013 8:11 AM, Allan H wrote:
> >>>>>>>      > > there is great value in systematic enlightenment,,,  I also
> >>>>>>> think
> >>>>>>>      > > though that in needs to be a attachment to those out of the
> >>>>>>>      box and
> >>>>>>>      > > not dismissing them..  knowledge and access to it is spread
> >>>>>>>      through
> >>>>>>>      > > out humanity.   the problems comes when someone starts
> >>>>>>> saying I
> >>>>>>>      > > deserve more.
> >>>>>>>      > > On Sat, May 11, 2013 at 3:23 AM, James <ashkas...@gmail.com
> >>>>>>>      <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>      > > <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com>>>
>
> ...
>
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>
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