Re: Mind's Eye Re: deep thought

A secular ideology can function in the same deceitful manner re
religion/political motives/designs.

On May 13, 5:01 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> the quasi - religious groups are politics in disguise I think is very
> true.. the morality or lack of morality play a great deal in politics..
>  with US tax exempt laws they create a haven for hiding money..  the
> question is how do you separate them?
>
>
>
> On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 11:16 AM, rigs <rigs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I'm not sure you can separate that easily from western civilization
> > and modern cultural off-shoots such as America and Australia. Early
> > America was quite dependent on European models and very sensitive
> > about the dependency. The variations are slight- highway robbers/
> > mounted knights= outlaws/cowboys? You get the idea and it can be a bit
> > of fun-mostly, but not always- to trace backwards or sideways. Of
> > course, WWII was a pivot. Economics and science are as much a part of
> > culture as the arts or social behaviors. Your quasi-religious groups
> > are really politics in disguise.
>
> > On May 11, 3:18 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I don't hold with culture as much rigs.  Europeans seem to share a
> > > common ancestor as little as 1000 years ago on recent DNA research in
> > > PLOS biology.  In cultures around the world one finds penis chopping
> > > (just up the road from here in Horwich or PNG) and gang rape.
> > > Genocide is almost everywhere.  The Nazis may even have been an Anglo-
> > > American invention to prevent a Soviet-German block - we have form
> > > before and after using quasi-religious groups to rule for our hidden
> > > agendas.  I fancy we should look more to how to change our cultures
> > > and prevent ourselves being manipulated by loonies.
>
> > > On 11 May, 13:11, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > there is great value in systematic enlightenment,,,  I also think
> > though
> > > > that in needs to be a attachment to those out of the box and not
> > dismissing
> > > > them..  knowledge and access to it is spread through out humanity.
> > theiet
> > > > problems comes when someone starts saying I deserve more.
>
> > > > On Sat, May 11, 2013 at 3:23 AM, James <ashkas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > I agree that learning is self taught on the condition that most of
> > the
> > > > > means and content is circumstantial and not chosen, 'systematique'
> > is an
> > > > > abstraction and so for most I think it has referential truth (as a
> > > > > resource) but not process modeling truth until the mind has worked
> > out
> > > > > components, inner systems and interactions.
>
> > > > > An aim for building problem solving intelligence, developing
> > experience
> > > > > with the tools of learning and skill in adapting skills/knowledge to
> > solve
> > > > > novel (relatively) problems seems a good rough-draft purpose. The
> > building
> > > > > blocks are important, they don't fall into arrangement the same for
> > > > > everyone though and that makes it challenging. I've had a few days
> > where
> > > > > the teachers instruction seemed a variation on 'first world
> > problems' and
> > > > > many of my schoolmates were hardened in that way, this is a known
> > unknown,
> > > > > the challenge is an opportunity I think.
>
> > > > > Gabby I was pulling a Marvin the Martian earlier, my general usage of
> > > > > enlightenment seems to be similar to Allan's, or as a 'piercing a
> > veil of
> > > > > ignorance'. I hoped to get a view from Konara, but your tips were,
> > hmm
> > > > > 'enlightening' nonetheless. ;-)
>
> > > > > On 5/9/2013 9:27 PM, rigs wrote:
>
> > > > >> You need basic skills to begin with, however, and these are only as
> > > > >> successful as certain other qualities/opportunities are present or
> > > > >> attainable. Morality is generally picked up from family, tribe,
> > > > >> nation, religion, political theory. There are plenty of examples of
> > > > >> evil or poor choices made by popular consent/majority opinion. What
> > is
> > > > >> the ultimate purpose of education? Wisdom? Income? Etc.?
>
> > > > >> On May 9, 4:11 pm, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > >>> What Neil says is that all learning is self taught - and so you are
> > > > >>> always
> > > > >>> successful. The question here is what you learn. The moral that you
> > > > >>> acquire
> > > > >>> while learning sans systematique is definitely more difficult to
> > justify,
> > > > >>> yes.
>
> > > > >>> 2013/5/9 Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>  Interesting the self taught often succeed..  could be it seems
> > what they
> > > > >>>> do not learn appearantly is morality  or how to justify their
> > actions..
> > > > >>>> On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 2:20 AM, rigs <rigs...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>> I don't know either work referred to but not sure society could
> > > > >>>>> tolerate this kind of freedom in education or workplace with a
> > few
> > > > >>>>> exceptions. Funny, but the self-taught often succeed. Anyway,
> > society
> > > > >>>>> needs to control its education and workplaces- esp. since the
> > > > >>>>> Industrial Revolution. Another thought is the object of
> > work<education
> > > > >>>>> is often just about money though many are dedicated to ideals and
> > > > >>>>> service and money is an afterthought or nevermind.
> > > > >>>>> On May 7, 1:46 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>> The short story is as Gabby remembers.  20 years ago I ran a
> > module
> > > > >>>>>> called Creative Organisational Practices.  The essential choice
> > for
> > > > >>>>>> students was to study the comparative relevance of Enid Blyton
> > > > >>>>>> (children's stories) and 'In Search of Excellence' to management
> > > > >>>>>> practice (both clearly fictional) or do something "creative" to
> > stop
> > > > >>>>>> me lecturing on this and do something they invented.  That
> > might be
> > > > >>>>>> education.
> > > > >>>>>> On 7 May, 08:42, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>> thank you  it is starting to make sense now
> > > > >>>>>>> On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 9:41 AM, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com>
> > > > >>>>>>> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>>> oh  to many drugs,,I guess epilepsy medications have severe
> > side
>
> > > > >>>>>>> effects
>
> > > > >>>>>> On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 9:33 AM, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>>>>> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>> Search for the word on the group site and you will find older
>
> > > > >>>>>>>> contexts in
>
> > > > >>>>>> which the word has been used. As far as I remember Neil
> > introduced
>
> > > > >>>>>>>> it,
>
> > > > >>>>>> sketching up education as being super male in its ejaculation
>
> > > > >>>>>>>> orientation
>
> > > > >>>>>> and super female in its child minding orientation. Truth for
>
> > > > >>>>>>>> Dummies.
>
> > > > >>>>>> 2013/5/7 Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> sorry Neil Ejukation is a word i cannot find ..  as a
> > result I am
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>> not
>
> > > > >>>>>> sure what you are saying..
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 9:02 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>> Ejukation is basically child-minding - we give the little dears
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> easy
>
> > > > >>>>>> things to do so we can praise them.  The ones too stupid to
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> realise
>
> > > > >>>>>> its all rubbish and bail out early end up with the biggest debts
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> - all
>
> > > > >>>>>> very meritocratic!  The world would work rather well on a 2-day
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> week.
>
> > > > >>>>>> The ejukationist's job is to stop people realising this, the
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> classroom
>
> > > > >>>>>> the straight-jacket through which we get people used to not
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>> doing what
>
> > > > >>>>>> they want to.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> On 6 May, 10:50, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> knowledge is enlightenment --  spiritual enlightenment
> >  ---
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>   well
>
> > > > >>>>>> there are
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> more ideas and ramblings people call enlightened..    at
> > least
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> a enlightened carpenter the enlightenment will show up in
> > his
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> work.
>
> > > > >>>>>> On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 11:13 AM, gabbydott <
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>> gabbyd...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>>>> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> We used to view what I think you are describing through
> > the
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> 'Wissen' -
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> 'Können' glasses. The spiritual dimension needed the right
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> justification
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> and calibration of both. We now ask if you:
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> know-that/know-about/know-how/**know-why/know-what.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> 2013/5/6 Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> there are many forms of enlightenment.. a skilled
> > carpenter
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> can be
>
> > > > >>>>>> enlightened on crafting wood.. a nurse can be enlightened
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> on caring
>
> > > > >>>>>> for patients  . . .   there are many different forms of
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> enlightenment..
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> spiritual enlightenment is perhaps the most confusing of
> > all
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> knowledge..
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 10:01 AM, gabbydott <
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> gabbyd...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>>>> wrote:
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> Of course a more figurative light is being meant! The
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> trouble
>
> > > > >>>>>> remains
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> the same. "Enlightenment" is the word. The context makes
> > it
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 'Aufklärung' or
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> 'Erleuchtung', light particle or light wave.
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2013/5/6 James <ashkas...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Konara, rigsy, all. I am wondering if this is a
> > more
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> figurative
>
> > > > >>>>>>>>>>>> 'light'..? In the sense that it illuminates the world and
>
> ...
>
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>
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