proposed the "Radical Creed," which, "as I understand it, is this: We
have not abandoned our old belief in liberty, justice, and Self-help,
but we say that under certain conditions the people cannot help
themselves, and that then they should be helped by the State
representing directly the whole people. In giving this State help, we
make three conditions: first, the matter must be one of primary social
importance ; next, it must be proved to be practicable; thirdly, the
State interference must not diminish self-reliance. Even if the chance
should arise of removing a great social evil, nothing must be done to
weaken those habits of individual self-reliance and voluntary
association which have built up the greatness of the English people.
The latest in the dynasty is Polly - who I know slightly and find
haplessly out of touch.
On Oct 30, 3:08 am, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Isn't Diamond primarily dealing with enviornmental factors of decline
> and Eurocentric though the axis is East-West? What about Arnold
> Toynbee's theories?// There is diversity in the public schools/state
> universities- USA- of race and incomes. Unfortunately, many limousine
> liberals send their children to private schools, don't they?//We are
> all "remotely" dark-skinned.
>
> On Oct 28, 2:11 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > In intellectual terms the 'positive' is often doxa or mere opinion.
> > Most white people I know think 'our' civilization is superior to all
> > others - I'd say this especially of the political correctivists and
> > those who raise racism at the drop of a hat. There is often less
> > racism in the guy who utters 'I hate niggers' (there are still plenty)
> > and the PC white female lecturer teaching this is wrong but who never
> > works with or has relations with anyone remotely dark-skinned.
> > There's an example of the critique of much received history here -http://www.lrb.co.uk/v33/n21/pankaj-mishra/watch-this-man-and I'd
> > point out that Niall Fergusson's books make it to television series
> > here and the US - who is the audience for the dross - racist dross in
> > 'polite language'. The positive of this critique can be found in
> > Jared Diamond. The big missing positive is about how we deal with
> > oppression everywhere, including that we soak up in our non-critical
> > cultures.
>
> > On Oct 28, 8:27 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > I hear and understand what you are saying Vam.. now the question is how
> > > does one counter them..
>
> > > rigsy don't be deceived it is those pay large sums for access to
> > > politicians that put them in congress american people are just sheep doing
> > > what they are told (more or less -- they follow the guiding light,,, TV
> > > commercials)
>
> > > Plato is right Communism is elitist ... it is based off community a town
> > > is a community, a city is a community .. slums are a community wall
> > > street is a very elitist community only interested in their good,, not the
> > > greater good of all people,, and they are very good at giving there song
> > > and dance routine.
> > > work
> > > Slums are a commune in their own right they are people gathering together
> > > for their own survival..
>
> > > The most successful communities have been religious where they have a
> > > common belief system. If you want your form of communism to survive you
> > > have to have a very common guiding light? a treat of eternal damnation
> > > does not hurt to keep the leadership in line .. but that does not always
> > > work..
>
> > > I do think the a social communism can work but every one is and must be
> > > expected to work contributing to the over all good of the community.. and
> > > if members are unemployed they need to be contributing to the greater
> > > community's greater good by sweeping streets or some thing.. with everyone
> > > contributing their paycheck and receiving a stipend from the community as
> > > we do need our pocket change. lol I have seen religious communities that
> > > you are expected to work 12 hrs + a day just for your ?room? and minimal
> > > board..for nothing especially when you are not part of their community..
>
> > > What an endless topic. rag on and on
> > > Allan
> > > Allan
>
> > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 8:55 PM, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Good questions.
>
> > > > Precisely... people realise they voted for promises and make - beliefs
> > > > presented by liars, who spoke for the people and acted for
> > > > themselves ! Now, the ill-intentioned must know that the people
> > > > know... what was concealed from them.
>
> > > > On Oct 27, 5:33 pm, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > So- who voted the Congress into power? Who is attracted to politics?
> > > > > Why?
>
> > > > > On Oct 26, 11:34 am, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > Members of Congress who are millionaires ? Nearly 50 percent.
>
> > > > > > Millionaires in the country ? About 1 percent of the population.
>
> > > > > > Doesn't seem the US Congress is representative of the population at
> > > > > > all !
>
> > > > > > On Oct 26, 4:45 pm, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Oh yeah Richard,, unfortunately politics is heavily influnced
> > > > > > > by corporate bribery and wealthy individuals who leave me wondering
> > > > if they
> > > > > > > care about their money or the people they are supposed to care for
> > > > and look
> > > > > > > after there interest.
> > > > > > > Politicians seem to have a creed that was pointed out earlier by a
> > > > member
> > > > > > > of this group. Politicians seem to say one thing then do something
> > > > entirely
> > > > > > > different.
> > > > > > > Allan
>
> > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 12:25 PM, richard blay <richsu...@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > Perfectly, Allan, on the part of the politicians. until part of the
> > > > > > > > solution is done, which is your idea on board, the situation will
> > > > ever
> > > > > > > > remain as it is...even worse.
>
> > > > > > > > On 10/26/11, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > Politicians have truths that apply to everyone else except them.
> > > > and they
> > > > > > > > > never feel the sting of the whip.
> > > > > > > > > I know over here the politicians doubled their salaries just
> > > > before
> > > > > > > > > the financial crash, not surprising though the pay raise was
> > > > never
> > > > > > > > removed
> > > > > > > > > the extra income, so they live at twice the wage while no pay
> > > > raises
> > > > > > > > not
> > > > > > > > > even cost of living for public employees like fire department ,
> > > > Police
> > > > > > > > > people or others..
>
> > > > > > > > > I am sure that if you look the same thing has happened in your
> > > > country no
> > > > > > > > > matter which one it is.. Politicians seem to be acting on
> > > > their own
> > > > > > > > > behalf and those of their rich friends..
>
> > > > > > > > > Maybe all politicians should be put on minimum wage with no
> > > > assistance
> > > > > > > > > from friend or family.. with only services of public
> > > > > > > > > assistance available to them and their family. I do know
> > > > something needs
> > > > > > > > > to be done to bring this political privilege under control..
> > > > maybe a
> > > > > > > > > better way to put it is get control of the out right bribery.
> > > > > > > > > Allan
>
> > > > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 10:09 AM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > >> I tend to like the idea too Allan - one way to the positive is
> > > > to do.
> > > > > > > > >> In the more intellectual sense, getting to the positive (which
> > > > has
> > > > > > > > >> many definitions) usually means stripping away loads of dross.
> > > > In the
> > > > > > > > >> process one usually finds the dross is cherished and part of the
> > > > > > > > >> reason nothing can ever get done!
>
> > > > > > > > >> One aspect of all the nonsense of current economic utterings
> > > > that
> > > > > > > > >> makes me laugh at the moment (or is it cry?) is the idea of
> > > > raising
> > > > > > > > >> pension age in order to save money - this is full of
> > > > assumptions that
> > > > > > > > >> there re jobs to do, that clinging to one doesn't prevent
> > > > someone else
> > > > > > > > >> doing it and so on.
>
> > > > > > > > >> On Oct 25, 8:19 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> > Lol do I start with you Gabby? I would not want to push
> > > > people. If
> > > > > > > > they
> > > > > > > > >> > wanted to contribute it would be great. A larger starting
> > > > point, but
> > > > > > > > >> > nothing beyond their means though.
>
> > > > > > > > >> > I can not help but wonder how it will evolve, I am sure it
> > > > will be
> > > > > > > > >> > interesting,
> > > > > > > > >> > Allan
> > > > > > > > >> > On Oct 25, 2011 9:03 AM, "gabbydott" <gabbyd...@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > >> > > I quite like your idea, Allan. You've got my vote to keep
> > > > on trying
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > >> > > persuade the others to see if they have some 100 Euros to
> > > > spare.
>
> > > > > > > > >> > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 7:58 AM, Allan H <
> > > > allanh1...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > >> > >> I know Neil it is but a pittance that is what so funny
> > > > about it..
> > > > > > > > >> > >> I
> > > > > > > > >> > >> think the problem lies in the short term,, Maybe that is
> > > > what it
> > > > > > > > >> should
> > > > > > > > >> > >> be called is the pittance fund..
> > > > > > > > >> > >> Money is a problem because it is guided by people who's
> > > > interests
> > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > >> self
> > > > > > > > >> > >> centered. creating the pittance fund,, then we have the
> > > > time and
> > > > > > > > >> > >> possibility to get it to grow.. and provide the long term
> > > > guidance
> > > > > > > > >> to make
> > > > > > > > >> > >> it successful over 500 plus years where it would reach the
> > > > size..
> > > > > > > > at
> > > > > > > > >> witch
> > > > > > > > >> > >> time the pittance fund would be as powerful or more
> > > > powerful than
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > >> other
> > > > > > > > >> > >> markets.. it takes for sight..
> > > > > > > > >> > >> What I am saying by putting up my 100 Euro is that our
> > > > combined
> > > > > > > > >> > >> wisdom
> > > > > > > > >> > >> and knowledge exceeds that of the normal public. it would
> > > > be
> > > > > > > > chance
> > > > > > > > >> to put
> > > > > > > > >> > >> our theories into practice.. Even if we fail we have tried
> > > > and can
> > > > > > > > >> not be
> > > > > > > > >> > >> faulted for that.. but I do not think that will happen,,
> > > > > > > > >> > >> Allan
>
> > > > > > > > >> > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 2:54 AM, archytas <
> > > > nwte...@gmail.com>...
>
> read more »
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