I think you understand how bad the world economy is. I think you're aware of the massive political chicanery known colloquially as "crony capitalism." When we are at the point where you must be in Government to succeed then that's where the sharks will gravitate. And us tax payers will give them our money and they will decide which monopolies to give it to so they can receive their kick backs. I mean campaign donations. Laws will be passed to protect the favored companies(such as GE) while rivals(energy companies) are punished with regulation and perpetual dragging of feet to get permission to run a pipeline or drill. Thus is the way of the world and wishing isn't going to change it. I'd rather instill in our youth a burning ambition to succeed. To become the next Steve Jobs or Carlos Slim or John D. Rockefeller. Telling them the government owes them a living probably isn't the best way to accomplish this.
Not sure what you mean bringing up Africans and Indian aborigines. That is a problem for Africa and India, no? I would welcome them here, of course. We need all the immigrants we can get to help pay my social security in about 30 years. It's the only way I'll ever see a dime. Come on down but bring a healthy work ethic. Freeloaders get the boot. Well, in my little fantasy world they do anyway. What, Capitalists can't dream? There are no race cards in my deck buddy.
I have no objection to a people "growing as they will" either. I'm sure we have something they want. In fact, Vam, I wonder if that really isn't at the root of much of the trouble? Could it be......Envy? Everybody looooves to bash on the Big Bad USA but looking around I still see we seem to be doing......better then most. Even if the whole thing IS a house of cards. Where will your high-minded ideals come in when those cards come down? It'll be every man for himself and dog eat dog. Family and friends first.
Oh my I think I may have gone off the reservation here. Morals. No, tithing doesn't necessarily equate to having a high moral standard. However, in the case of JD Sr. and Jr. their largesse knew no bounds. Excessively frugal in their personal lives and excessively generous in their public lives. Honestly, with a simple look at history and current events I don't see how ANYONE could dislike or resent rich people as a class. They give more than anybody else. By a fairly large margin.
dj
On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 10:07 AM, Vam <atewari2007@gmail.com> wrote:
" morals = tithe faithfully "
That's how pathetic the belief springs from :
" Without an avenue to create wealth people will be less productiveThe people " here " are less naive than you, Don. Much, much less, I
which means there will be less largess for the needy and helpless."
must point out.
It's not the absence of avenues of wealth creation they seek. They
seek people who can create wealth and disown its power of becoming a
weapon to enslave others, deny others, own others, influence public
policy, affect electoral outcomes, buy off common resources for
commercial and personal gains, acquire rights to do as one pleases
with the right to ownership of property, skew world world markets,
twists financial structures...
In short, stop creating lesser " dog-like " mercenary humans amongst
us, degrade environments, and actually reduce opportunities for
populations everywhere to grow, as they will, not as they are
commanded by the money bags for the latter's feudal interests.
They can keep all their wealth and splurge it in the luxury market.
But not in owning people, markets, finance structures and instruments,
land, natural resources, investing in electoral outcomes and public
policy, etc.
I hope you now understand the people " here " ... they believe the
Rockfeller is no more or less than Indian aborigine you've denied or
the African native who is yet to learn to be as smart as the white
folk, or the homeless tramp closer home. If he can't be homeless,
because of his wealth, he at least can extend his understanding and
initiative for their benefit, being only as human and no more. If he
can't be as unsmart as the African, he can at least enable them and
not derive advantage. If he can't undo the fate if the Indian
American, he can at least stand with them and admit his wrong.
> particular was scrupulously honest and even before
On Dec 14, 4:45 pm, Don Johnson <daj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm couldn't disagree more. The most successful people in the world
> are often driven by a high sense of morals. J.D. Rockefeller in
> he obtained success and could afford it. Without an avenue to create
> wealth people will be less productive which means there will be less
> largess for the needy and helpless. I wonder at the naivete I see
> here. Will everyone truly be more happy when we are all distitute? I
> think not.
>
> dj
>
> On Dec 6, 1:47 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Francis of Assisi once said that it is better to understand than be
> > understood. there is a time to understand what the wise men of the past had
> > to say and why they said it.
> > The world has a lot of problems today and a great deal of double talk and
> > little action or direction. Most and a lot of what is said is irrelevant
> > and immaterial.
>
> > The changes the world needs to escape from a market economy and back more
> > to a traditional economy where local value come into much greater play,
> > this is where the jobs are created,, On the other hand in the market
> > economy everything is driven by the profit. The profit concept and the loss
> > or creation of jobs is entirely irrevelent,, all that is of importance is
> > making a profit no matter the effect on the population. As I examine the
> > problem looking for what has changed what seems to pop out is the loss of
> > morality. Oddly what I do not see is the extreme protestant view
> > that morality was everything, Not that I think it was great or really
> > approve of it,,, it what I now see is it shifting to preachers out
> > screaming "Have you accepted jesus christ as your personal savior" leaving
> > a total vacancy in the importance of morality.
>
> > As I watch the news the focus is on the markets.. and the market people
> > trying to control the world.. that gets into my opinion which is of little
> > value..I do think though that a direction of increasing morality..
> > Allan
>
> > On Tue, Dec 6, 2011 at 7:42 AM, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Perhaps... especially for you...
> > > the solution would be more effectively and compellingly projected on
> > > images of beauty. All the science in the world cannot match its power
> > > to move us.
>
> > > Why ? Better, How ?
> > > By filling us with feeling, void of thought, and making us come alive.
>
> > > On Dec 6, 3:12 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Camels make horrendous noise too rigsy. The dried dung was once used
> > > > to bake bread on. We can no doubt any grand narrative but don't seem
> > > > much good at using this to create new ones. It's all deconstruction
> > > > when we need to be ab;e to deconstruct and rebuild.
>
> > > > On Dec 5, 11:36 am, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > I read the "needle" was a tight gate in the walls around ancient
> > > > > Jerusalem and traders loaded with booty and goods had difficulty
> > > > > squeezing through. I did ride a camel in Egypt and they are smelly
> > > > > beyond belief.
>
> > > > > On Dec 5, 3:08 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > LOL oddly it is possible to get a camel through the eye of a
> > > needle of a
> > > > > > needle.. it is possible but you have to get a camel to walk on its
> > > knees..
> > > > > > but there is a price to pay for that..
> > > > > > Allan
>
> > > > > > On Mon, Dec 5, 2011 at 9:27 AM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > You must have discovered how muh harder it gets to thread the eye
> > > of a
> > > > > > > needle as the simplicity of youth fades Allan!
>
> > > > > > > On Dec 5, 4:35 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > II just received from a friend of mine and Tim always makes me
> > > think..
> > > > > > > It
> > > > > > > > really suddenly dawned on me (I can be all wet) is the suppose
> > > of
> > > > > > > religion
> > > > > > > > is not really for salvation and the nest life but in reality is
> > > to teach
> > > > > > > > morality.
>
> > > > > > > > It seems that the churches to day give a quick brush over
> > > morality and
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > get to the work of salvation.. and the next life.. I am laughing
> > > to my
> > > > > > > self
> > > > > > > > because if you lose morality you lose salvation. The greatest
> > > problems
> > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > this day are the lose of morality and the teaching of
> > > morality,, It
> > > > > > > seems
> > > > > > > > the teaching of morality is for the other guy but the rules of
> > > morality
> > > > > > > do
> > > > > > > > not apply to me.
> > > > > > > > Allan
>
> > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 5, 2011 at 4:45 AM, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > Well sadly Ireland is good of a country giving away what is
> > > not
> > > > > > > theirs to
> > > > > > > > > start off with..
> > > > > > > > > and you are right most of the problems are moral ones.
> > > > > > > > > religious leaders are as much fault as they no longer teach
> > > morality
> > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > > their fundamentalism,, but rather in christianity's case all
> > > is for
> > > > > > > given
> > > > > > > > > if you accept jesus christ as your personal savior..
>
> > > > > > > > > I see the Us has passed a new law giving the military
> > > > > > > > > complete authority with out fear of the Justice system.. it
> > > will be a
> > > > > > > > > while but before long the USA will become a military
> > > dictatorship..
> > > > > > > A sad
> > > > > > > > > moment in US history. I think this is a result of the Occupy
> > > movement
> > > > > > > > > putting fear into the Banksters ,, lead by the wealth of the
> > > > > > > Republican
> > > > > > > > > party and the 1% knowing the people are right and being afraid
> > > that
> > > > > > > they
> > > > > > > > > have been caught and unwilling to give up power..
> > > > > > > > > Allan
>
> > > > > > > > > On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 10:28 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
>
> > >http://www.scientificamerican.com/podcast/episode.cfm?id=killing-one-.
> > > > > > > ..
>
> > > > > > > > >> I believe most of our "economic" problems are really moral
> > > ones. The
> > > > > > > > >> problem is most of what "morality" is is just so much turkey.
> > > The
> > > > > > > > >> problem expressed in the link above is whether to divert a
> > > train that
> > > > > > > > >> will kill 5 innocent people to another line where it will
> > > kill only
> > > > > > > > >> one innocent person. 90% of us divert the train in a
> > > simulation.
>
> > > > > > > > >> Moral problems as posed to me in real life have never been so
> > > simple.
> > > > > > > > >> I won't go into them here but can hint. In the UK's internal
> > > war in
> > > > > > > > >> Northern Ireland I was asked to do appalling things with
> > > informants
> > > > > > > > >> (and via pressuring wives and families) - the excuse was 'the
> > > greater
> > > > > > > > >> good'. I know now I was conned.
>
> > > > > > > > >> What might a modern morality of the greater good be? What
> > > are the
> > > > > > > > >> problems with "morality" and how might we fix them. The
> > > Saudis are
> > > > > > > > >> putting forward interesting extremes such as allowing women
> > > to drive
> > > > > > > > >> cars 'bringing about' all sorts of corruption like
> > > homosexuality and
> > > > > > > > >> adultery. What of the role of madness, rationalisation and
> > > the clown
> > > > > > > > >> zealot in morality? And what role do facts play?
>
> > > > > > > > >> The train example is easy - but what if the person on the
> > > other line
> > > > > > > > >> is your son or daughter? Would you shoot a child suicide
> > > bomber
> > > > > > > > >> advancing into a crowded area if you had time to run to her
> > > and only
> > > > > > > > >> put your life at risk? Do you really think your performance
> > > in the
> > > > > > > > >> field would match that in thought experiment?
>
> > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > (
> > > > > > > > > )
> > > > > > > > > |_D Allan
>
> > > > > > > > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>
> > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > (
> > > > > > > > )
> > > > > > > > |_D Allan
>
> > > > > > > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > (
> > > > > > )
> > > > > > |_D Allan
>
> > > > > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > --
> > (
> > )
> > |_D Allan
>
> > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
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