Re: Mind's Eye thought experiments

How very Protestant of you Gabby. Spinoza concluded much the same.
The fundamentalists are out of order as they make sacred scripture
into an Idol for worship. I don't do godswank myself, though it may
be I'm regarded as too enigmatic to invite to coffee mornings and
parties with talking snakes and golden salamanders. I can't kneel in
fellowship based in rules with only socially approved epistemic
authority.

On Oct 16, 6:45 am, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Agree entirely, Rigs !
>
> The " your-God - my-God " argument ... and "God power" ... ** sigh ***
>
> I believe, Jethro Tull says much of what I feel in : *"My God"*
>
> People -- what have you done --
> locked Him in His golden cage.
> Made Him bend to your religion --
> Him resurrected from the grave.
>
> He is the god of nothing --
> if that's all that you can see.
>
> You are the god of everything --
> He's inside you and me.
>
> So lean upon Him gently
> and don't call on Him to save you
> from your social graces
> and the sins you used to waive.
> The bloody Church of England --
> in chains of history --
> requests your earthly presence at
> the vicarage for tea.
>
> And the graven image you-know-who --
> with His plastic crucifix --
> he's got him fixed --
> confuses me as to who and where and why --
> as to how he gets his kicks.
>
> Confessing to the endless sin --
> the endless whining sounds.
> You'll be praying till next Thursday to
> all the gods that you can count.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, October 16, 2012 8:01:47 AM UTC+5:30, rigsy03 wrote:
>
> > "God powers" might also be a way of saying possession of grace in a
> > religious sense. Not sure what race has to do with this as we humans
> > arrive with the same form- what separates us is equity in several
> > ways. Political structure is a matter of timing and luck plus picking
> > the right side/group for the most part if you insist humans are
> > political by nature. I think there are agreed principals of ethical
> > behavior- universals- murked up with particulars. There is also a
> > recognition of evil as a force to contend with- internal and external.
>
> > On Oct 15, 6:40 pm, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I'll pick up the stone
> > > (http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/07/reasons-matter-when-i...)
>
> > > and argue that I cannot know if your Gods are false or not. Not
> > > because I am not a religious man, or a black man, or a political man,
> > > but because I am an individual and thereby only possess restrained
> > > demonstrable God powers myself.
>
> > > On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 10:36 AM, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > All Gods that religious men speak about, brandish shall we say, are
> > false.
>
> > > > The one distributing those "commandments" included.
>
> > > > Which is not what I would say about individuals who take initiatives
> > to
> > > > restrict people from moral turpitude and unethical conduct.
>
> > > > On Monday, October 15, 2012 11:01:46 AM UTC+5:30, Allan Heretic wrote:
>
> > > >> doesn't one of the commandments say something about false gods?
> > > >> Allan
>
> > > >> On Mon, Oct 15, 2012 at 6:15 AM, rigsy03 <rig...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >> > Thank you, Vam- I hope it is another precious visit.
>
> > > >> > Politics has become a "religion", as well. Just substitue a few
> > words
> > > >> > in your paragraph. :-)
>
> > > >> > On Oct 13, 5:38 pm, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >> >> Rigs, I can't help but think of the presence of a daughter and her
> > > >> >> family
> > > >> >> as " Happy Times " with grand-daughters ... noise, play, shout,
> > > >> >> request,
> > > >> >> demand and irritate, reminisce and gossip ,,, ! Hope it acrually
> > turns
> > > >> >> to
> > > >> >> be a happy interlude .
>
> > > >> >> I have no doubts about severely debilitating and cosmic effects of
> > > >> >> religions that junk reason and humanity, and demand their
> > adherents too
> > > >> >> to
> > > >> >> remain steadfast with the irrational. An institutional frame of
> > clerics
> > > >> >> and
> > > >> >> clergy for global control is no more than a prison, covered with
> > very
> > > >> >> beguiling but false promise of freedom.
>
> > > >> >> On Saturday, October 13, 2012 6:20:40 PM UTC+5:30, rigsy03 wrote:
>
> > > >> >> > Not sure if religion, cults, tribal mischief did not have the
> > same
> > > >> >> > effect Vam. Consider the countless wars, for instance. But I
> > think
> > > >> >> > western man has turn the Age of Machines into a new religion and
> > one
> > > >> >> > could draw many parallels- and has, via artists and authors.
> > Anyway,
> > > >> >> > after spending way too much time finding a new niche for my
> > morning
> > > >> >> > coffee maker before my daughter and two grand-daughters come for
> > the
> > > >> >> > Xmas holidays (!), I have certainly racked up the equivalent of
> > a
> > > >> >> > novena! BTW, a couple of years ago I noticed my feet were
> > slightly
> > > >> >> > stiff in the morning and I worried that my flight to the kitchen
> > for
> > > >> >> > a
> > > >> >> > mug of coffee could be perilous so I bought one of those small
> > coffee
> > > >> >> > makers for the upstairs and now include a muffin- just to rev up
> > the
> > > >> >> > joints before I seize the day. :-) Anyway, this might be a good
> > idea
> > > >> >> > for any who need to warm/rev up. (This is my machine
> > confession.) On
> > > >> >> > the other hand, I have been negotiating with the Divine for a
> > new
> > > >> >> > lawn/
> > > >> >> > snow guy and I am on the brink of success! lol
>
> > > >> >> > On Oct 11, 6:28 am, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >> >> > > Bingo ! * sounding the drums *
>
> > > >> >> > > But what gives it the merit also renders science blind to much
> > that
> > > >> >> > > is
> > > >> >> > > essential to our humanity, which are abstract and non-material
> > ...
> > > >> >> > beauty,
> > > >> >> > > ethics, morals, truth, compassion, happiness, love, etc.
>
> > > >> >> > > Albert Einstein expressed is eloquently ... as have several
> > others.
>
> > > >> >> > > There has been much since science overwhelmed us. But
> > everytime it
> > > >> >> > > has
> > > >> >> > > served to delete a part or measure of our humanity, mankind
> > has
> > > >> >> > > struck a
> > > >> >> > > blow at its own foot !
>
> > > >> >> > > On Wednesday, October 10, 2012 5:46:04 PM UTC+5:30, rigsy03
> > wrote:
>
> > > >> >> > > > I wasn't clear. I was thinking about new ideas and
> > inventions
> > > >> >> > > > which
> > > >> >> > > > made older ideas and inventions obsolete or mere stepping
> > stones
> > > >> >> > > > to a
> > > >> >> > > > greater truth. Science seems more open to changes and
> > advances
> > > >> >> > > > for the
> > > >> >> > > > most part though Darwin had a struggle but that was because
> > he
> > > >> >> > > > stepped
> > > >> >> > > > into religious territory which might mean that we are more
> > open
> > > >> >> > > > to
> > > >> >> > > > change when it does not involve emotions and beliefs versus
> > > >> >> > > > demonstrable facts.
>
> > > >> >> > > > On Oct 9, 9:08 am, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >> >> > > > > It will still be more clever than the rest !
>
> > > >> >> > > > > On Tuesday, October 9, 2012 5:04:27 PM UTC+5:30, rigsy03
> > wrote:
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > Until the next cleverest man/woman comes along! :-)
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > On Oct 8, 5:56 pm, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >> >> > > > > > > " Machines are only as clever as they have been
> > programmed
> > > >> >> > > > > > > to
> > > >> >> > > > > > > be. In some cases that may mean smarter than some
> > humans
> > > >> >> > > > > > > for
> > > >> >> > > > specific
> > > >> >> > > > > > > acts or purposes ... "
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > > If a machine is programmed by the cleverest man,
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > > it would not be ' only ' as clever as it has been
> > > >> >> > > > > > > programmed
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > > but it would be more clever than every other man on
> > the
> > > >> >> > > > > > > planet !
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > > On Monday, October 8, 2012 5:01:02 PM UTC+5:30,
> > rigsy03
> > > >> >> > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > And certain ants have also figured out how to enter
> > the
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > honey
> > > >> >> > bee
> > > >> >> > > > as a
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > parasite which has an ominous impact on pollination.
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > Species
> > > >> >> > pick
> > > >> >> > > > up
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > their behaviors from their groups- some are more
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > dedicated-
> > > >> >> > > > patterns
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > can be disrupted.// Anyway, aren't you equating
> > worth
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > with
> > > >> >> > money/
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > salary?//Machines are only as clever as they have
> > been
> > > >> >> > programmed
> > > >> >> > > > to
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > be. In some cases that may mean smarter than some
> > humans
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > for
> > > >> >> > > > specific
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > acts or purposes but still short of general
> > intelligence,
> > > >> >> > insight
> > > >> >> > > > and
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > adaptation.// Old age is not necessarily "lousey"
> > except
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > the
> > > >> >> > final
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > chapter is death and certain goals were not realized
> > or
> > > >> >> > possible.
> > > >> >> > > > Hard
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > work/age does not create arthritis- that is a myth.
> > The
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > 12
> > > >> >> > year
> > > >> >> > > > old
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > across the street has arthritis and started some
> > exercise
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > for
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > violinists.
>
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > On Oct 7, 9:51 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > > The archaeological evidence is that such things as
> > the
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > > move
> > > >> >> > to
> > > >> >> > > > > > farming
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > > from hunter-gathering did not improve the human
> > lot for
> > > >> >> > those
> > > >> >> > > > who
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > > cleared and dug sod (arthritis etc. from the
> > work).
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > > The
> > > >> >> > obvious
> > > >> >> > > > > > issue
> > > >> >> > > > > > > > > for present society concerns the
>
> ...
>
> read more »

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