Re: Mind's Eye UFO's: Fact or Fantasy?

Not many are willing to put up with the chaos and violence of public
schools plus those who can afford it are thinking of the future
contacts and colleges they want for their children. Parents are sick
of the cultural garbage.

On Oct 4, 3:51 am, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Roughly the same thing going on here with confessional schools. The
> avoidance motif is where I see the problem begins.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 1:20 PM, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Catholic schools are rebounding to avoid public schools and are
> > attended by several faiths. The tuition is adjusted if one is a
> > parishoner, i.e. less tuition since you are expected to tithe, so it
> > probably works out to the same amount.
>
> >> > Hello Gabby --it's great to meet you too.  I don't know what happened with
> >> > the name thing --I'm sure one William L. Houts is enough for anyone.
>
> >> > --Bill
>
> >> > On 10/1/2012 10:02 AM, gabbydott wrote:
>
> >> > Hello Bill, I noticed that your screen name on the group website is rather
> >> > long. It reads: William L. Houts William L. Houts Lukaeon William L. Houts.
> >> > I was wondering if this was your intention.
>
> >> > Maybe yes. Just so much, I do differentiate between heaven and afterlifeand their individual usability for corruption. Both terms are somehow
> >> > related to the future, but the access is different. Sorry, I forgot to
> >> > introduce myself. My name is Gabby (short for Gabriele), I am a Protestant,
> >> > my first language is German, and I believe in God. I like to listen to
> >> > other people's stories which is why I have learned to keep my own very
> >> > short. Nice meeting you. :)
>
> >> > On Friday, September 28, 2012 7:17:08 AM UTC+2, William L. Houts William
> >> > L. Houts Lukaeon William L. Houts wrote:
>
> >> >> I wonder if humans do dream of uncorrupted worlds, in general. You'd
> >> >> think that would be universal, and it does seem to be borne out by
> >> >> Western mythologies, with some exceptions.  For instance, the Greeks had
> >> >> Olympus, but except for Heracles no one got to go there; everyone else
> >> >> went to Hades, which was gloomy and boring if you were lucky enough to
> >> >> land there in general population, and terrifying if the gods put you in
> >> >> Tartarus.  And the Romans didn't seem to place faith in any sort of
> >> >> afterlife at all, which is one of the main reasons whyChristianity sold
> >> >> like hotcakes.  Eastern religions such as Buddhism had various hells and
> >> >> heavens, but they were sort of besides the point:  your karma is / was
> >> >> supposed to boil down to nothing and liberate you from the Wheel of
> >> >> Rebirth, which was supposed to put you  in Nirvana, which was less a
> >> >> Heaven than it was a Nowhere. And Taoism doesn't have much to say about
> >> >> heavenly afterworlds;  its whole point is to make this world more just
> >> >> and balanced and leaves heavens to the individual to figure out.
>
> >> >> But as to your question of whether humans long for uncorrupted worlds, I
> >> >> think that besides the Abrahamic religions noone takes them very
> >> >> seriously.  And I think they've got a point:  I mean, if you're taking
> >> >> your present existence at all seriously, then just what is an afterlife
> >> >> supposed to be about?  Are we supposed to be eating bonbons all day and
> >> >> living in some version of American luxury?  I'd like to believe in
> >> >> Heaven  --which for me looks like a kind of liberal college town, with
> >> >> libraries and funky old cinema houses-- but all of that seems kind of
> >> >> empty if there's no gravitas, no seriousness.   Without death, without a
> >> >> final marker which howls at us, Do what you must do NOW and die knowing
> >> >> that you've used your life well--without that, I think heaven would
> >> >> become kind of slouchy and boring, or worse.  Unless, of course, what's
> >> >> waiting for us on the other side is something superrational but
> >> >> beautiful, like being absorbed into the godhead, if such there be.
>
> >> >> So in answer to your question, I think we do dream of uncorrupt worlds,
> >> >> but if we examine them too closely, they tend to be bustable soap
> >> >> bubbles. And maybe I lack imagination, but I wonder, how could it be any
> >> >> other way?  Frankly, I'd like to be told how. I sound sensible about all
> >> >> of this if a little pessimistic, but in reality I'm a scared ex-Catholic
> >> >> who is terrified  of death and wants to solve the Big Question before
> >> >> they're performing Last Rites on his sorry ass.
>
> >> >> --Bill
>
> >> >> On 9/27/2012 7:20 PM, rigsy03 wrote:
> >> >> > I wonder where you put the mythological and religious other-worldlies-
> >> >> > from gods to guardian angels, etc.? Or the construct of Dante's
> >> >> > "Divine Comedy", for instance. Do humans long for uncorrupted worlds?
>
> >> >> > On Sep 27, 6:23 pm, William L Houts <luka...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> >> I'm with the pragmatists on the question of intelligent alien species.
> >> >> >> Many scientists who speculate on this sort of thing --though there
> >> >> >> really aren't that many of them-- say that such species wouldn't
> >> >> >> resemble anything so comforting as a humanoid physiology, but I think
> >> >> >> they're partly mistaken.  Surely there would be surprises in the way
> >> >> >> nature cooks up life on other planets with radically different
> >> >> >> chemistries than our dear old Mama Earth.  But I think there's reason
> >> >> to
> >> >> >> suppose that many alien species would resemble us.  After all, any
> >> >> >> species we might imagine has to cope with gravity as it evolves.  So
> >> >> >> they're much more likely to evolve some form of locomotion which
> >> >> >> involves  two, four or six pedal extremities (as Fats Waller calls
> >> >> them)
> >> >> >> rather than three or five:  even-numbered legs are less wobbly and
> >> >> more
> >> >> >> amenable to balanced movement which consumes fewer calories. . Also,
> >> >> >> sense organs like eyes and ears are likely to be located in or close
> >> >> to
> >> >> >> a head, as there is survival value in having sense organs located
> >> >> close
> >> >> >> to a brain, or whatever such species might use for brains. Finally,
> >> >> >> everyone in the cosmos requires energy to get going, so they're
> >> >> either
> >> >> >> going to evolve photosynthesis and take their energy directly from
> >> >> their
> >> >> >> sun or suns, or they're going to take their sunbeams indirectly by
> >> >> >> consuming something lower in the food chain.  I'm sure there are lots
> >> >> of
> >> >> >> evolution pathways I'm leaving out, seeing as I'm a curious poetrather
> >> >> >> than a serious scientist type of guy, but I think these notions are,
> >> >> as
> >> >> >> Allan named other ideas of mine, sensible provisos.
>
> >> >> >> PS.  I left out centipedes and millipedes with their scores of legs,
> >> >> but
> >> >> >> I think y'all's get what I'm saying here.
>
> >> >> >> --Bill
>
> >> >> >> On 9/27/2012 3:57 PM, archytas wrote:
>
> >> >> >>> I haven't seen any UFOs and tend not to be much interested in people
> >> >> >>> who claim to have - at least without Bill's sensible provisos.  The
> >> >> >>> speed of thought as a brain process is slower than light-speed - but
> >> >> >>> then I'm basically a tropical fish realist.  I'd have a bet that no
> >> >> >>> one in this group would really have much of a definition of light-
> >> >> >>> speed and the Ricel curvature tensor, Euler Langrangian and the rest
> >> >> >>> of Einstein's field equations.  I mean no offence and don't do much
> >> >> of
> >> >> >>> this science myself.
> >> >> >>> If you point out to a physicist that the people from the future who
> >> >> >>> have invented the time machine are in extraordinarily short supply
> >> >> in
> >> >> >>> our present he may come up with some mathematical guff on the shape
> >> >> of
> >> >> >>> the universe that explains this or makes time travel only possible
> >> >> to
> >> >> >>> the future.  I have seen demons - plodding back to camp after a
> >> >> week's
> >> >> >>> endurance exercise with no food for two days I was visually
> >> >> convinced
> >> >> >>> the sentries were vampires but still asked them where the Naffi was.
> >> >> >>> My guess is that we travel through space as primitive life-forms with
> >> >> >>> evolution built-in and waiting to unfold.  We may thus have come
> >> >> from
> >> >> >>> a much more advanced civilisation than ours bound by the speed of
> >> >> >>> light, capable of the biological engineering but not space-flightmuch
> >> >> >>> more advanced than our own.  Calculations give 28 years as the time
> >> >> to
> >> >> >>> reach the edge of the known universe - but this is the time insidethe
> >> >> >>> ship accelerating to near light speed fairly slowly.   Space is not
> >> >> >>> friction free and it's doubtful we or our instruments could take the
> >> >> >>> radiation of light-speed flight.
> >> >> >>> I rather hope there are some nice, genuinely civilised aliens
> >> >> thinking
> >> >> >>> of coming here.  In my speculation, intelligent life tends to worry
> >> >> >>> about food chains led by apes as these have been notoriously war-like.
>
> >> >> >>> I'm into bees and ants rather than UFOs at the moment.  Bees use
> >> >> >>> 'pharma' to combat fungal infections.  Ants take slaves - killing
> >> >> the
> >> >> >>> adults of another species and taking the larvae.  These slaves then
> >> >> >>> raise the slaver brood.  Interestingly, the ant slaves rebel and
> >> >> kill
> >> >> >>> the pupae of their masters - an act that does not favour the
> >> >> >>> individuals a they will die, but does seem to be altruistic in favour
> >> >> >>> of other colonies of the enslaved species.  I mention this to
> >> >> suggest
> >> >> >>> science is not a human invention, just something in evolution we are
> >> >> >>> expanding.
> >> >> >>> UFOs remind me of religion generally - people seem to bond around
> >> >> >>> ludic claims about golden salamanders and what cannot be proved.  I
> >> >> >>> guess we will find life or past life-sign on Mars.  Salvation may
> >> >> come
> >> >> >>> from a mother-ship, but my own feeling is that our inability to
> >> >> >>> develop science as we could is a more important thought experiment.
> >> >> >>> In
>
> ...
>
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