Re: Mind's Eye What to do about the rich?

Or thieves cannot tolerate someone else's good luck or fortune- so
they steal it.

On Mar 12, 1:29 pm, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know for a fact my great grandfather was the one that originally
> found the copper mine in Butte Mt.. only to have it stolen by extreme
> dishonest means,,  the rich it seems can not tolerate someone else
> that is not in there circle becoming  wealthy..    Controlled fraud is
> a good way to put it..
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 2:42 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > The big myth is that rich people have worked hard for their wealth and
> > deserve it (pace rigs).  Even the slavers were paid off in huge
> > amounts and one can trace such money to the present day - much the
> > same true of Nazi businesses.  We are hooked into a control fraud.
>
> > On Mar 11, 8:35 pm, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> I know what you mean Neil,,  Seems that change is starting..  the
> >> Doctors over here started a web page against tobacco.. and they are
> >> revealing those legislator that are being influenced by the tobacco
> >> lobby..  it seems like light is beginning shine in the darkness..
> >> I support the Light.
>
> >> On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 2:45 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > The madness of it is they got us thinking their interests were our
> >> > interests.  Adam Smith warned against that at some length.
>
> >> > On Mar 8, 2:16 pm, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> You would think that over the centuries man would learn..  actually I
> >> >> think it is starting to happen with the new banking laws coming into
> >> >> play. hand shake deals will becoming to an end and taxes where the
> >> >> rich like it or not will have to be paid..  off shore banks will be
> >> >> finding it much more difficult to transfer money..
>
> >> >> Oddly before long there will be more careful examination ass to where
> >> >> wealth came from and how it was created..   there appear to be grass
> >> >> root changes taking place..  Neil that is where sound direction is
> >> >> needed ..  a place for these roots to grow and better society.
>
> >> >> On Fri, Mar 8, 2013 at 12:50 PM, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> > There have been many good points made in what has been said here. Yet I do
> >> >> > believe that at this stage of our evolution we must know our past by heart
> >> >> > and keep on acting with/on a common forward orientation. What I see being
> >> >> > described as a phenomenon at the top, I see happening at the grassroots
> >> >> > level also. Heaven and Hell meet where the airspace allows for dust
> >> >> > particles to form clouds and where the earth evaporates conceivable amounts
> >> >> > of sulfuric gasses.  After all that has been freed from a Pawlowian drooling
> >> >> > reflex and is being seen as potentially deconstructable, Connectivism is the
> >> >> > new tribalism operating at both ends. Goethe's "Wahlverwandschaften" being
> >> >> > read through the chemist's glasses.  There is no back to family visits when
> >> >> > you are busy building your tribe. The foam carpet is not being exposed by
> >> >> > highlighting its most spectacular and fluorescent bubbles.
>
> >> >> > 2013/3/8 archytas <nwte...@gmail.com>
>
> >> >> >> We must make our choice. We may have democracy, or we may have wealth
> >> >> >> concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both.  (Justice
> >> >> >> Louis Brandeis)
> >> >> >> The rich are independent of the rest of us. Obviously they are
> >> >> >> materially independent so long as their property rights remain
> >> >> >> recognized. They can achieve what they want by themselves, that is by
> >> >> >> buying it from others or paying someone else to do it for them. But
> >> >> >> this power of command also generates a social distance from society
> >> >> >> that allows them to become 'ethically independent'. Since they don't
> >> >> >> depend on the goodwill of others to succeed - for example, few of them
> >> >> >> have recognisable jobs - they may become less concerned in general
> >> >> >> about whether they deserve goodwill.
> >> >> >> That means that the rich don't have the same political interests as
> >> >> >> the rest of us. They aren't worried about crime (their gated
> >> >> >> communities come with private security) or the quality of public
> >> >> >> education (their kids go to the fanciest schools money can buy) or
> >> >> >> affordable accessible health care, job security, public parks, gas
> >> >> >> prices, environmental quality, or most of the other issues that the
> >> >> >> rest of us have no choice but to care about, and to care about
> >> >> >> politically since they are outside of our individual powers to fix.
> >> >> >> The political concerns of the rich do not lie in the provision of
> >> >> >> public goods, but in furthering their private interests, whether their
> >> >> >> personal wealth and power or their political whimsies. This is why
> >> >> >> Adam Smith warned us so vehemently to be suspicious of their self-
> >> >> >> serving rhetoric (e.g. WN I.11.264).
> >> >> >> It is sometimes thought that the rich are necessary to the flourishing
> >> >> >> of a free market economy, that because they have more wealth than they
> >> >> >> need for their own consumption it is their investment of capital that
> >> >> >> makes the economy spin around and create jobs. Thus the claim that
> >> >> >> there is a trade-off between democracy and material prosperity. But
> >> >> >> that 'job creator' thesis is out of date and back to front.
> >> >> >> First, while in Adam Smith's time it might have been true that
> >> >> >> economic development required capitalists to reinvest their profits
> >> >> >> this was because everyone else was too poor. But these days the
> >> >> >> economies of democratic societies are characterized by a broad middle-
> >> >> >> class whose savings are quite sufficient for funding business
> >> >> >> development and expansion (such as through the share-ownership of our
> >> >> >> pension funds or the bank loans backed by our deposits).
>
> >> >> >> Second, the greater the wealth inequality, the worse we may expect the
> >> >> >> economy to perform. A flourishing economy requires customers as well
> >> >> >> as investors. If the gains of economic productivity are overwhelmingly
> >> >> >> transferred to some small group (as profits) that means that they
> >> >> >> don't go to ordinary people (as wages). (For example, since 1979 all
> >> >> >> the productivity gains of America's economy have gone to the richest
> >> >> >> 1%.) The implications are, first, that economic growth does not
> >> >> >> increase national prosperity because it does not increase the economic
> >> >> >> command of ordinary people to satisfy our wants (which is how Smith
> >> >> >> defined the wealth of nations). And, second, economic growth itself
> >> >> >> will eventually suffer since high inequality limits the extent of the
> >> >> >> market (fewer customers) and thus the scope for innovation.
> >> >> >> Hence my modest proposal. We should first identify with some precision
> >> >> >> the category of what it seems reasonable to call the rich i.e. those
> >> >> >> people whose capabilities for independence from and command over the
> >> >> >> rest of us crosses the threshold between enviable affluence and
> >> >> >> aristocratic privilege. Then, when anyone in our society lands in the
> >> >> >> category of the problematic rich we should say, as at the end of a
> >> >> >> cheesy TV game show, "Congratulations, you won the economy game! Well
> >> >> >> done." And then we should offer them a choice: give it away (hold a
> >> >> >> potlatch, give it to Oxfam, their favourite art museum foundation, or
> >> >> >> whatever) or cash out their winnings and depart our society forever,
> >> >> >> leaving their citizenship at the door on their way out. Since the rich
> >> >> >> are, um, rich, they have all the means they need to make a new life
> >> >> >> for themselves elsewhere, and perhaps even inveigle their way into
> >> >> >> citizenship in a country that is less picky than we are. So I'm sure
> >> >> >> they'll do just fine. Still, we can let them back in to visit family
> >> >> >> and friends a few days a year - there's no need to be vindictive.
>
> >> >> >> --
>
> >> >> >> ---
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> >> >> > --
>
> >> >> > ---
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> >> >> --
> >> >>  (
> >> >>   )
> >> >> |_D Allan
>
> >> >> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>
> >> >> Of course I talk to myself,
> >> >> Sometimes I need expert advice..
>
> >> > --
>
> >> > ---
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> >> --
> >>  (
> >>   )
> >> |_D Allan
>
> >> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>
> >> Of course I talk to myself,
> >> Sometimes I need expert advice..
>
> > --
>
> > ---
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group.
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> --
>  (
>   )
> |_D Allan
>
> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>
> Of course I talk to myself,
> Sometimes I ...
>
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