Re: Mind's Eye trust

I would not go so far as to generalize about any class, race,
ethnicity, society, gender, age.... People are varied in each
category, and lumping everyone that falls into a certain category
together with all others and assigning them general attributes, well,
biased is one of the milder terms used. I know I have never liked to
be labeled or categorized. Looking back, I have hit every socio-
economic strata but that 1% in my time, and don't ever expect to be
super rich. But, that one lottery ticket a year that I buy could just
take me there as anything is possible in this crazy life. All that
money sounds like a lot of work, especially keeping it out of the
hands of the bwankers and shysters. And those guys come in all shapes
and sizes.

On Jun 7, 10:11 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not really Rigsy --   there is a lot of corruption and immorality involved
> the rich for the most part are very self centered focusing mainly on their
> interests and not those of humanity as a whole.  you can claim yo have not
> done it  but you are riding on the shirt tails of those who have..  this
> action only encourages them...
>
> the excuse of being enabled by the government and laws does not really hold
> water..  especially on the spiritual plane,,  sorry Rigsy  you have been
> alerted to the problem..   but do as you want
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 3:49 PM, rigs <rigs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > The rich are enabled by the government and laws.
>
> > On Jun 7, 12:18 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > We could probably find something like that in Mein Kampf too Molly.
> > > Andrew is on to something with the forgiveness angle.  We might have
> > > to do a lot of that when it dawns on us we've been had on a butty by
> > > the rich.
>
> > > On May 27, 1:04 pm, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Just found this in my mailbox:
>
> > > > "As soon as you trust yourself, you will know how to live." - Goethe
>
> > > > On May 26, 4:05 am, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > well Rigsy  they are lucky i do not tell others how to do it,,
> >  simply
> > > > > because it is easy enough  ,,,  so to be democratic I am supposed to
> > > > > approve of the actions of the majority of those that are raping and
> > > > > pillaging the government to line their pockets..  but I forget you
> > love
> > > > > those ?good? guys..  defending their actions at every turn
>
> > > > > On Sat, May 25, 2013 at 11:30 PM, rigs <rigs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > You are not a very good example of a democratic society when you
> > talk
> > > > > > like that Allan. No wonder it doesn't work. Found a fake bill with
> > > > > > anti-FDR slogans when my father was in Hollywood so the rift goes
> > on
> > > > > > and on, I guess. Actually, the types in Dante's Inferno are with us
> > > > > > still- am down to the Florentine bankers.
>
> > > > > > On May 25, 1:51 pm, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > what Gabby sent was right..  what is the thing with the prisoner
> > of war
> > > > > > > camp the US insist on keeping   or at  least the republicans
> > insist on..
> > > > > > >  actually It would be fun to set up a house of horrors
> > especially built
> > > > > > >  for them..  bet in three days or less I could get them willing
> >  to
> > > > > > resign
> > > > > > > form politics and give me all their personal money and family
> > fortunes..
> > > > > > >  The problem is I am not allowed to do harm  so sad sometimes
>
> > > > > > > On Sat, May 25, 2013 at 8:18 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > > > > > Lovely Gabby.
>
> > > > > > > > I can't other than agree Molly.  I've held (as long as Allan
> > has his
> > > > > > > > soul-god thingy) that there is far less individual about the
> > human
> > > > > > > > that we think - Gabby mentions a bit of the German for gossip
> > in
> > > > > > > > another thread and I doubt much human communication is much
> > more than
> > > > > > > > this and we struggle to realise how connected with hierarchy
> > it is.
> > > > > > > > We find ourselves working with "individuals" when we need to
> > work with
> > > > > > > > the network.  Continuing the Freudian theme, the best
> > individuals come
> > > > > > > > from the best societies and the best societies are made by the
> > best
> > > > > > > > individuals.  Gabby's ain't it so not fits that too.  We now
> > split the
> > > > > > > > electron into holon, spinon and orbiton but still struggle to
> > see
> > > > > > > > multiple aspects of such as trust.
>
> > > > > > > > On May 25, 9:12 am, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > Yeah, it ain't.
> > > > > > > > > communi Am 25.05.2013 07:20 schrieb "Allan H" <
> > allanh1...@gmail.com
> > > > > > >:
>
> > > > > > > > > > ain't that the truth
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Fri, May 24, 2013 at 11:38 PM, Molly <
> > mollyb...@gmail.com>
> > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > >> Trust is all too often manipulated onto people who don't
> > > > > > understand,
> > > > > > > > > >> and there are far too many.  then there are people who
> > > > > > understand, but
> > > > > > > > > >> allow, because they feel they are powerless do do
> > otherwise.  all
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > >> it gives us a picture of ourselves that we either
> > recognize or
> > > > > > look
> > > > > > > > > >> away from.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> On May 24, 4:35 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >> > I don't really want to imagine a Hollywood version of
> > Gitmo
> > > > > > Gabby.
> > > > > > > >  By
> > > > > > > > > >> > the end we'd believe a truth machine turned all the evil
> > > > > > terrorists
> > > > > > > > > >> > orange.  We've just had a terrorist moment in the UK -
> > the
> > > > > > killing
> > > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > >> > a soldier in Woolwich (Drummer Rigby).  The idiots who
> > did it
> > > > > > were
> > > > > > > > > >> > well known activists.  There's a trust issue in even
> > this sort
> > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > >> > stuff.  When you can't trust politics what are you
> > supposed to
> > > > > > do?
> > > > > > > > > >> > The Germans should have saved us a lot of bother by
> > protesting
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > >> > Nazis - a few did.  Democracy is supposed to give voice
> > to
> > > > > > minority
> > > > > > > > > >> > opinion but rarely does.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > Even on stuff like climate change we have big
> > problems.The
> > > > > > so-called
> > > > > > > > > >> > "deficit model" suggests that the public lacks certain
> > knowledge
> > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > >> > if it were known properly (so closing the deficit)
> > would lead
> > > > > > them
> > > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > >> > favor certain policy actions. In other words, if only
> > you
> > > > > > understood
> > > > > > > > > >> > the "facts" as I understand them, then you would come
> > to share
> > > > > > my
> > > > > > > > > >> > policy preferences.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > The deficit model helps to explain why people argue so
> > > > > > passionately
> > > > > > > > > >> > about "facts" in public debates over policies with
> > scientific
> > > > > > > > > >> > components. If you believe that acceptance of certain
> > scientific
> > > > > > > > views
> > > > > > > > > >> > is a precondition for, or a causal factor in
> > determining what
> > > > > > policy
> > > > > > > > > >> > views people hold, then arguments over facts serve as
> > political
> > > > > > > > debate
> > > > > > > > > >> > by proxy.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > Dan Kahan, professor of psychology at Yale Law School,
> > has
> > > > > > conducted
> > > > > > > > > >> > several studies of public views on climate change and
> > finds
> > > > > > that the
> > > > > > > > > >> > causal mechanisms of the "deficit model" actually work
> > in
> > > > > > reverse:
> > > > > > > > > >> > people typically "form risk perceptions that are
> > congenial to
> > > > > > their
> > > > > > > > > >> > values." Our political views shape how we interpret
> > facts. On an
> > > > > > > > issue
> > > > > > > > > >> > as complex as climate, there are enough data and
> > > > > > interpretations to
> > > > > > > > > >> > offer support to almost any political agenda. Thus we
> > have
> > > > > > arguments
> > > > > > > > > >> > over the degree or lack of consensus among scientists,
> > and see
> > > > > > > > efforts
> > > > > > > > > >> > to delegitimise outlier positions in order to assert
> > one true
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > >> > proper interpretation. Added to the mix is the
> > temptation to
> > > > > > push
> > > > > > > > > >> > "facts" beyond what science can support, which offers
> > each side
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > >> > opportunity for legitimate critique of the excesses of
> > their
> > > > > > > > > >> > opponents. These dynamics can (and do) go on forever.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > We obviously do much the same on such matters as
> > imperialism and
> > > > > > > > > >> > terrorism.  The killing in London was a breach of trust
> > - but I
> > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > > >> > show the same breach in which investments made by a US
> > > > > > university
> > > > > > > > lead
> > > > > > > > > >> > to dead black bodies in the Congo.  I was conned a a
> > young man
> > > > > > into
> > > > > > > > > >> > believing I could work virtuously for my country as a
> > soldier -
> > > > > > this
> > > > > > > > > >> > turned out not to be true.  I deeply regret some of
> > what I did,
> > > > > > > > though
> > > > > > > > > >> > things might have been worse if it had been someone
> > else than
> > > > > > me.
> > > > > > > >  The
> > > > > > > > > >> > techniques used to bind you to comrades in arms are, of
> > course,
> > > > > > > > > >> > propaganda.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > A big problem with trust is it is so easy to
> > manipulate.  I
> > > > > > don't
> > > > > > > > > >> > trust most people to enter argument on the basis their
> > mind
> > > > > > might
> > > > > > > > > >> > change.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > On 24 May, 15:48, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > You may be right rigs.  that hero's quest moves us
> > along in
> > > > > > ways
> > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > >> > > include our infinite aspects.  I also like Andrew's
> > insight
> > > > > > into
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > >> > > relationship between trust and forgiveness.  You may
> > be on to
> > > > > > > > > >> > > something there, Andrew.
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > On May 24, 8:33 am, rigs <rigs...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > Some may have been trained not to trust from the
> > start and
> > > > > > live
> > > > > > > > out
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > the prophecies imposed as if in a dream. Hopefully
> > love and
> > > > > > > > > >> education
> > > > > > > > > >> > > > can change the script and intercede when old
> > grooves of
>
> ...
>
> read more »

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