Re: Mind's Eye Re: Delusions

The epidemiology is probably quite clear to epidemiologists Molly.  And there lies the rub.  How do the rest of us cope with the statistics involved and understand the risks and benefits?  We had measles parties far more dangerous than inoculation, but safer than getting the disease as adults.  The public debate or lack of it is very worrying.  Duck and cover!

The role of ignorance in delusion is complex.  Authorities assume the masses are ignorant and patronise a simplified positive case and various others then get in with crank and actual critique.  Similar issues can be found in the 3-parent baby debate. The classic delusion is that we vote on the economy, knowing no economics (let alone it is a dud deception), even at the level of newsroom punditry that plays to the delusion.

On Monday, February 9, 2015 at 12:17:06 PM UTC, Molly wrote:

I've been wondering about this whole measles outbreak frenzy and am appalled at the seemingly intelligent people impassioned about it and missing so many of the important points in their arguments:

1. History shows us occasional outbreaks of disease that populations have been inoculated against

2. In researching numbers beyond the CDC accounts, there appears to be many more cases of measles last year than the current outbreak

3. We give our children three times the number of vaccinations that we did a generation ago and standard protocol is to give them some on the day they are born

4. My son was given the measles vaccine at age two and a half. Now it is administered before age one in the recommended schedule

5. No one is talking about the know side effects to each vaccine or cases where vaccines are directly  related to health problems

It seems to me that delusions can be not only originated but perpetuated by groups that look away for all of the info, focusing instead on a few facts that provide the spin of the agenda and the fear that carries it through the crowd. Don't get me wrong, I am not advocating "no vaccines" for children, but do think the current hysteria in the US delusional.

On Monday, February 9, 2015 at 5:41:40 AM UTC-5, archytas wrote:

People generally don't talk about what is happening to them like that Tony.  The academic language get so high falutin as to be part of the deception itself as a weird abstraction.  There are some obvious experiments we do, yet people go away imagining they saw through the illusion even though we make it plain they didn't.  Goffman was quite good in 'presentation of self' but the real trick would be getting people to talk about their own experience.  My excuse for seeing newsroom women as 'sex objects' is because they never deliver any news.  Some would see this as an old man's delusion, but I think an entirely different illusion is created

I agree all your points and wonder how long the list would be.

On Monday, February 9, 2015 at 2:01:36 AM UTC, facilitator wrote:

Sorry to get back on topic but this interests me.

"How are delusions maintained, as in creationism, democracy, free trade, markets, the wars on drugs, terrorism and amongst cops, social workers and …."

Best way to maintain a delusion:

1)  Numerically.  Easier to maintain a delusion when it is held by a majority.

2)  Chronoligically.   It has been this way for….  Why would it be different now?

3)  Embellishment.   Add a bit of gravitas by associating the delusion with prominent figures, scientists, heads of religious orders etc.

4)  Hide its toxic nature.  Keep the poison palatable by mixing with enough truth in order to change its color or palatability.

5)  Multiplicity. Add a delusion to the delusion so the first delusion becomes less deniable.  

6)  Serial encryption.   Pack the delusion with a series of undeniable facts.

7)  Geographic lamination.   Move the context of the delusion so that it becomes difficult to challenge.  Example:  "Finish your vegetables there are children starving in China"

8)  Terminology disassociation.  When the government wants to hide it's killing of innocent civilians (example: Waco,TX) the name of the living quarters changes from school to "compound".

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