Re: Mind's Eye What is really going on in America?

You are right rigsy - but we have to get somewhere beyond. What is it
in our arguments, sentiments and the rest that hold us back? And may
be very wrong?

Allan is right we could vote better with our wallets. We could, for
instance, all bank with mutuals and have more local economies
(Andrew). Problems are as Andrew says when the wallet is empty and
also that we already have 'one dollar one vote'.

I doubt the academic-legal-commercial argument as argument at all. We
have a paedophile scandal in the UK - but even the media reporting it
has forgotten it reported such a generation ago (the key documentaries
were called 'Cathy Come Home'.and 'Johnny Go Home') and misses the
point that they key point is what evidence we can believe when false
accusations are so easy to make and make life very difficult for real
victims. Our public inquiry systems are proving increasingly
untrustworthy. When one teaches critical reasoning it quickly becomes
clear most people are no good at it. I'm quite sure our mainstream
media has almost no clue and that many lawyers, judges and politicians
would fail standard tests. But surely the route here cannot be to
elite groups of philosopher kings - but should be towards properly
available facts - leaving us with problems about who controls that
production. 'The rich', whoever they are, already do this.


On 11 Nov, 11:33, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Matriarchies are what started the problems and from history they tend
> to love war..
> they are not a solution..
> Allan
>
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> On Sun, Nov 11, 2012 at 10:49 AM, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > I think that matriarchies are back in style- in all races and nations-
> > and think it will be just as suffocating as the patriarchy.
>
> > On Nov 11, 1:39 am, andrew vecsey <andrewvec...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Voting with your wallet could be an effective way to change things and put
> >> the wealthy exploiters out of business. Buying cheap products is more
> >> expensive in the long term  anyways. Buying food from local markets is also
> >> healthier. As long as we all play the game, the game will keep playing
> >> until every business becomes a monopoly and globalization will take over
> >> our wallets. Once our wallets are gone, we are really screwed and will have
> >> no other choice than to play robin hood. So much for free markets.
>
> >> On Sunday, November 11, 2012 12:41:52 AM UTC+1, archytas wrote:
>
> >> > We lack simple explanation that isn't  crass Allan.  I have little
> >> > doubt the rich have stolen the wealth they have and it should be taken
> >> > from them - but how do we do this without it ending up with big
> >> > government that doesn't work any better?  I think we are tranced by a
> >> > work ethic that really makes no sense.  We need facts on just how much
> >> > work needs to be done and how we might organise that.  Simples!  Yet
> >> > no answer because we don't understand the 'trancing'.
>
> >> > On 10 Nov, 07:15, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > From what I see is the answer lies in manufacturing. And crazy things
> >> > like
> >> > > 50% less sales tax on products that are produced in the country origin,
> >> > > that includes good thru all industrial products.
>
> >> > > Better tax collection on all international corporations and stock or
> >> > money
> >> > > sent out of the country.
>
> >> > > In the US all corporation papers say they agree to abide by all the laws
> >> > > and if they don't they lose all corporate  rights and privileges. This
> >> > > needs to be enforced and you will see major changes in business. You
> >> > have
> >> > > to remember tax evasion is against the law.
> >> > > Allan
>
> >> > > Air gunner full of hot air ready to release it quickly
> >> > > On Nov 10, 2012 2:04 AM, "archytas" <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > The weird thing is that we are being told all sorts of stuff can't be
> >> > > > 'afforded' - yet productivity is up by factors of ten since we did
> >> > > > decent things like national health services - we should be able to
> >> > > > afford loads more.  In the UK we were told the answer was US
> >> > > > management, then Japanese - German stuff had too much industrial
> >> > > > democracy for our business ethos.  Even the IMF has realised austerity
> >> > > > is a crock.  We're in the grips of something else.  Debt is the
> >> > > > obvious answer -but we have to address our attitudes towards it.  Its
> >> > > > owned by robber barons and all link between work and reward has really
> >> > > > gone.
>
> >> > > > On 9 Nov, 21:59, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > > > I totally agree with you management is based on rot..but from what I
> >> > > > > have been reading it is the same problem from eons ago,,  unchanged
> >> > > > > what does it take to get management that is interested in the
> >> > > > > betterment of society ..  the ideas sit with in beliefs  which puts
> >> > > > > part of the burdens on religions ,, then the problems comes how does
> >> > > > > one get beliefs to work for the betterment of mankind in this world.
> >> > > > > Allan
>
> >> > > > > On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 9:45 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > > > > Get your head back on Al - I know about the Japanese war crimes.
> >> >  The
> >> > > > > > book I was referring to was written by a Japanese clown.  The
> >> > point is
> >> > > > > > that management miracles are based on rot..
>
> >> > > > > > On 9 Nov, 19:07, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > > > > >> Neil I had two uncles in ww II One in the European theater the
> >> > other
> >> > > > > >> was in pacific theater and was captured even before the war
> >> > started in
> >> > > > > >> my memory is right   he survived 2 death ship and four death
> >> > marches
> >> > > > > >> that is talking five years of imprisonment into account  loss of
> >> > close
> >> > > > > >> to 70 kilos..  you need to get your facts straight as to
> >> > strategies of
> >> > > > > >> both wars..  and if Germany was acting like J ,,  Berlin would
> >> > have
> >> > > > > >> been Nuclear ashes also..
>
> >> > > > > >> Yes  the US has serious fiscal problems..  thanks to some
> >> > > > > >> irresponsible politicians  starting with the Reagan
> >> > administration ..
> >> > > > > >> hopefully  they will get something done . and stop sticking one
> >> > thumb
> >> > > > > >> in their mouth and the other in their ass then rotating.
>
> >> > > > > >> As for what happens iihope for the best  but in reality   we will
> >> > > > see..
> >> > > > > >> Allan
>
> >> > > > > >> On Fri, Nov 9, 2012 at 6:23 PM, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com>
> >> > wrote:
>
> >> > > >http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/us-debt-problems-threaten-t...
>
> >> > > > > >> > The Germans are considering the USA as a potential Greece.
>
> >> > > > > >> > I'm remembering attitudes towards Japan in the 1980s.  There
> >> > was a
> >> > > > > >> > dreadful book called 'The Japan That Can Say No' which
> >> > summaries
> >> > > > thus:
>
> >> > > > > >> > + Japan must use its technological superiority as a negotiating
> >> > > > > >> > weapon, and it should
> >> > > > > >> > even threaten to trade secrets with the Soviet Union as a
> >> > bargaining
> >> > > > > >> > tool against the US and refuse to sell components that go into
> >> > US
> >> > > > > >> > missiles.
> >> > > > > >> > + The quality of American goods is low because the level of the
> >> > > > > >> > workers is low, while the superior education of Japanese
> >> > workers is
> >> > > > a
> >> > > > > >> > big advantage.
> >> > > > > >> > + The Japanese character is innately superior to the character
> >> > of
> >> > > > > >> > Americans.
> >> > > > > >> > + Americans believe that the Caucasian race is superior since
> >> > the
> >> > > > > >> > modern era is dominated by the western world, and this
> >> > prejudice
> >> > > > will
> >> > > > > >> > hurt them in the end.
> >> > > > > >> > + Former American colonies are rife with problems, while former
> >> > > > > >> > Japanese colonies are thriving.
>
> >> > > > > >> > + America's dropping of the atomic bomb on Japan and not
> >> > Germany in
> >> > > > > >> > World War II arose from racism because Germans are white people
> >> > and
> >> > > > > >> > Japanese are not. (Though at the time of the German defeat in
> >> > April
> >> > > > > >> > 1945, the atomic bomb was as yet incomplete and untested until
> >> > July
> >> > > > > >> > 16, 1945, so that may have been a factor)
> >> > > > > >> > + The trade surplus with the U.S. is caused by the lack of
> >> > desirable
> >> > > > > >> > products made in the U.S.
>
> >> > > > > >> > I read it on a plane out there on a journey to discover their
> >> > > > > >> > shipbuilding secrets.  I met a lovely bloke out there who told
> >> > me
> >> > > > the
> >> > > > > >> > idea of copying Japanese management secrets filled him with
> >> > dread.
> >> > > > > >> > The only secret was they were rotten, sexist and callous.
> >> >  Japan
> >> > > > fell
> >> > > > > >> > off its fiscal cliff when I left (1980s).  Almost sadly, this
> >> > wasn't
> >> > > > > >> > because of anything I left behind.  The 'brilliant' Japanese
> >> > > > > >> > management techniques were taught by lazy lecturers for the
> >> > next 20
> >> > > > > >> > years.
>
> >> > > > > >> > The coming fiscal cliff in the US isn't like Greece in that USD
> >> > can
> >> > > > be
> >> > > > > >> > printed at will.  Der Spiegel says this:
>
> >> > > > > >> > The US has more in common with heavily indebted southern
> >> > European
> >> > > > > >> > countries than it might like to admit. And if the country
> >> > doesn't
> >> > > > > >> > reach agreement on deficit reduction measures soon, the
> >> > similarities
> >> > > > > >> > could become impossible to ignore. The fiscal cliff looms in
> >> > the
> >> > > > near
> >> > > > > >> > future, and its not just the US that is under threat.
>
> >> > > > > >> > The US has finally voted and the dark visions of America's
> >> > future
> >> > > > > >> > broadcast on television screens across the country -- and most
> >> > > > > >> > intensively in battleground states -- have come to an end.
> >> > > > Supporters
> >> > > > > >> > of both Barack Obama and Mitt Romney had developed doomsday
> >> > > > scenarios
> >> > > > > >> > for what would happen if their candidate's opponent were to
> >> > win.
> >> > > > Four
> >> > > > > >> > more years of Obama, the ads warned, would result in pure
> >> > > > socialism. A
> >> > > > > >> > Romney presidency would see the middle and lower classes
> >> > brutally
> >> > > > > >> > exploited.
>
> >> > > > > >> > But following Obama's re-election, Americans are now facing a
> >> > > > > >> > different, much more real horror scenario: In just a few weeks
> >> > time,
> >> > > > > >> > thousands of children could be denied vaccinations, federally
> >> > funded
> >> > > > > >> > school programs could screech to a halt, adults may be forced
> >> > to
> >> > > > > >> > forego HIV tests and subsidized housing vouchers would dry up.
> >> > Even
> >> > > > > >> > the work of air-traffic controllers, the FBI, border officials
> >> > and
> >> > > > the
> >> > > > > >> > military could be drastically curtailed.
>
> >> > > > > >> > That and more is looming just over the horizon according to the
> >> > > > White
> >> > > > > >> > House if the country is allowed to plunge off the "fiscal
> >> > cliff" at
> >> > > > > >> > the beginning of next year. Coined by Federal Reserve
>
> ...
>
> read more »

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