Re: Mind's Eye UFO's: Fact or Fantasy?

This may be returning to a point in the conversation which we have long
since passed, but I'm still interested in the UFO thing. I've talked a
little about my one underwhelming UFO encounter, but I'm still
interested in some of the UFO baggage which has yet gone unpacked. In
particular, I'm interested in the alien abduction meme. What are these
people dealing with? They say, among other things, that aliens
--Greys, Reptilians, and Nordics among other varieties-- are breeding
them with alien races to create hybrids. Well. It hardly seems
possible, as any offworld species, having evolved many light years away
would hardly be compatible with Earth reproductive biology. And yet, I
feel there's something compelling in these accounts. Debunkers and
critics claim these are sophisticated sexual fantasies, but I really
don't think so. Most abduction experiencers ("experiencers")report
reactions of feeling raped rather than ennobled by these experiences.
Betty and Barney Hill, probably the original parents of the modern
abduction account, were recorded during their post-abduction therapy
sessions and can be heard screaming in terror. Jacques Valee, whom I
have referred to in the opening message of this thread, compares this
abduction story to medieval accounts of abductions by fairies.

I really don't think guys in space ships are raping earthfolk, but
something unusual is going on, and I would like to know, or at least
speculate, on what exactly is going on. Are these Space Age religious
experiences, dressed up in Star Trek costume?


--Bill



On 10/8/2012 4:05 AM, rigsy03 wrote:
> There is an area of the brain that stores certain memories. Also, I
> think memories can be provoked through associations (Proust).But this
> is an individual journey- not an explanation of our existence as a
> species. Since we are derived from fish I am hoping I was once a wily
> rainbow trout.:-) Anyway- I think memory makes sense of the past.
> Beliefs are wishful thoughts that will reward our behavior until
> proven otherwise- in this life and after death- but it does not
> successfully explain what has happened to all those anonymous
> millions.
>
> On Oct 7, 5:01 pm, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I believe in the possibility of something god-like. I doubt this has
>> much to do with meeting it second left past the burning bush. Even
>> the prophet we dare not mention seems to have been created in retro to
>> control the new empire. Origin is endlessly deferred or nachtraglich
>> and it is interesting we don't carry the memories on our journey and
>> yet respond to fellowship and wider demands of the extended
>> phenotype. Memory, false or otherwise, seems to be about making sense
>> of the future. UFOs may be about of concerns, as in religion, as to
>> why we are here. I am protestant by inclination, finding organised
>> religion a control fraud. It could be our memories are unpacking when
>> our god-spots do their thing. It's interesting in general that we see
>> things that don't exist like demons, UFOs and visions.
>>
>> On 4 Oct, 16:34, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> I do not think the schools are looking for the brightest but rather they
>>> are deliberately dumbing students down. Guess it is to keep them from
>>> learning to think for themselves.
>>> Allan
>>> On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 4:37 PM, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> Not many are willing to put up with the chaos and violence of public
>>>> schools plus those who can afford it are thinking of the future
>>>> contacts and colleges they want for their children. Parents are sick
>>>> of the cultural garbage.
>>>> On Oct 4, 3:51 am, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Roughly the same thing going on here with confessional schools. The
>>>>> avoidance motif is where I see the problem begins.
>>>>> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 1:20 PM, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Catholic schools are rebounding to avoid public schools and are
>>>>>> attended by several faiths. The tuition is adjusted if one is a
>>>>>> parishoner, i.e. less tuition since you are expected to tithe, so it
>>>>>> probably works out to the same amount.
>>>>>>>> Hello Gabby --it's great to meet you too. I don't know what
>>>> happened with
>>>>>>>> the name thing --I'm sure one William L. Houts is enough for anyone.
>>>>>>>> --Bill
>>>>>>>> On 10/1/2012 10:02 AM, gabbydott wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hello Bill, I noticed that your screen name on the group website is
>>>> rather
>>>>>>>> long. It reads: William L. Houts William L. Houts Lukaeon William
>>>> L. Houts.
>>>>>>>> I was wondering if this was your intention.
>>>>>>>> Maybe yes. Just so much, I do differentiate between heaven and
>>>> afterlifeand their individual usability for corruption. Both terms are
>>>> somehow
>>>>>>>> related to the future, but the access is different. Sorry, I forgot
>>>> to
>>>>>>>> introduce myself. My name is Gabby (short for Gabriele), I am a
>>>> Protestant,
>>>>>>>> my first language is German, and I believe in God. I like to listen
>>>> to
>>>>>>>> other people's stories which is why I have learned to keep my own
>>>> very
>>>>>>>> short. Nice meeting you. :)
>>>>>>>> On Friday, September 28, 2012 7:17:08 AM UTC+2, William L. Houts
>>>> William
>>>>>>>> L. Houts Lukaeon William L. Houts wrote:
>>>>>>>>> I wonder if humans do dream of uncorrupted worlds, in general.
>>>> You'd
>>>>>>>>> think that would be universal, and it does seem to be borne out by
>>>>>>>>> Western mythologies, with some exceptions. For instance, the
>>>> Greeks had
>>>>>>>>> Olympus, but except for Heracles no one got to go there; everyone
>>>> else
>>>>>>>>> went to Hades, which was gloomy and boring if you were lucky
>>>> enough to
>>>>>>>>> land there in general population, and terrifying if the gods put
>>>> you in
>>>>>>>>> Tartarus. And the Romans didn't seem to place faith in any sort of
>>>>>>>>> afterlife at all, which is one of the main reasons whyChristianity
>>>> sold
>>>>>>>>> like hotcakes. Eastern religions such as Buddhism had various
>>>> hells and
>>>>>>>>> heavens, but they were sort of besides the point: your karma is /
>>>> was
>>>>>>>>> supposed to boil down to nothing and liberate you from the Wheel of
>>>>>>>>> Rebirth, which was supposed to put you in Nirvana, which was less
>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> Heaven than it was a Nowhere. And Taoism doesn't have much to say
>>>> about
>>>>>>>>> heavenly afterworlds; its whole point is to make this world more
>>>> just
>>>>>>>>> and balanced and leaves heavens to the individual to figure out.
>>>>>>>>> But as to your question of whether humans long for uncorrupted
>>>> worlds, I
>>>>>>>>> think that besides the Abrahamic religions noone takes them very
>>>>>>>>> seriously. And I think they've got a point: I mean, if you're
>>>> taking
>>>>>>>>> your present existence at all seriously, then just what is an
>>>> afterlife
>>>>>>>>> supposed to be about? Are we supposed to be eating bonbons all
>>>> day and
>>>>>>>>> living in some version of American luxury? I'd like to believe in
>>>>>>>>> Heaven --which for me looks like a kind of liberal college town,
>>>> with
>>>>>>>>> libraries and funky old cinema houses-- but all of that seems kind
>>>> of
>>>>>>>>> empty if there's no gravitas, no seriousness. Without death,
>>>> without a
>>>>>>>>> final marker which howls at us, Do what you must do NOW and die
>>>> knowing
>>>>>>>>> that you've used your life well--without that, I think heaven would
>>>>>>>>> become kind of slouchy and boring, or worse. Unless, of course,
>>>> what's
>>>>>>>>> waiting for us on the other side is something superrational but
>>>>>>>>> beautiful, like being absorbed into the godhead, if such there be.
>>>>>>>>> So in answer to your question, I think we do dream of uncorrupt
>>>> worlds,
>>>>>>>>> but if we examine them too closely, they tend to be bustable soap
>>>>>>>>> bubbles. And maybe I lack imagination, but I wonder, how could it
>>>> be any
>>>>>>>>> other way? Frankly, I'd like to be told how. I sound sensible
>>>> about all
>>>>>>>>> of this if a little pessimistic, but in reality I'm a scared
>>>> ex-Catholic
>>>>>>>>> who is terrified of death and wants to solve the Big Question
>>>> before
>>>>>>>>> they're performing Last Rites on his sorry ass.
>>>>>>>>> --Bill
>>>>>>>>> On 9/27/2012 7:20 PM, rigsy03 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> I wonder where you put the mythological and religious
>>>> other-worldlies-
>>>>>>>>>> from gods to guardian angels, etc.? Or the construct of Dante's
>>>>>>>>>> "Divine Comedy", for instance. Do humans long for uncorrupted
>>>> worlds?
>>>>>>>>>> On Sep 27, 6:23 pm, William L Houts <luka...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm with the pragmatists on the question of intelligent alien
>>>> species.
>>>>>>>>>>> Many scientists who speculate on this sort of thing --though
>>>> there
>>>>>>>>>>> really aren't that many of them-- say that such species wouldn't
>>>>>>>>>>> resemble anything so comforting as a humanoid physiology, but I
>>>> think
>>>>>>>>>>> they're partly mistaken. Surely there would be surprises in
>>>> the way
>>>>>>>>>>> nature cooks up life on other planets with radically different
>>>>>>>>>>> chemistries than our dear old Mama Earth. But I think there's
>>>> reason
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> suppose that many alien species would resemble us. After all,
>>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>> species we might imagine has to cope with gravity as it
>>>> evolves. So
>>>>>>>>>>> they're much more likely to evolve some form of locomotion which
>>>>>>>>>>> involves two, four or six pedal extremities (as Fats Waller
>>>> calls
>>>>>>>>> them)
>>>>>>>>>>> rather than three or five: even-numbered legs are less wobbly
>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>>>> amenable to balanced movement which consumes fewer calories. .
>>>> Also,
>>>>>>>>>>> sense organs like eyes and ears are likely to be located in or
>>>> close
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> a head, as there is survival value in having sense organs
>>>> located
>>>>>>>>> close
>>>>>>>>>>> to a brain, or whatever such species might use for brains.
>>>> Finally,
>>>>>>>>>>> everyone in the cosmos requires energy to get going, so they're
>>>>>>>>> either
>>>>>>>>>>> going to evolve photosynthesis and take their energy directly
>>>> from
>>>>>>>>> their
>>>>>>>>>>> sun or suns, or they're going to take their sunbeams indirectly
>>>> by
>>>>>>>>>>> consuming something lower in the food chain. I'm sure there
>>>> are lots
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>> evolution pathways I'm leaving out, seeing as I'm a curious
>>>> poetrather
>>>>>>>>>>> than a serious scientist type of guy, but I think these notions
>>>> are,
>>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>>>>> Allan named other ideas of mine, sensible provisos.
>>>>>>>>>>> PS. I left out centipedes and millipedes with their scores of
>>>> legs,
>>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>>>>> I think y'all's get what I'm saying here.
>>>>>>>>>>> --Bill
>>>>>>>>>>> On 9/27/2012 3:57 PM, archytas wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> I haven't seen any UFOs and tend not to be much interested in
>>>> people
>>>>>>>>>>>> who claim to have - at least without Bill's sensible provisos.
>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>>> speed of thought as a brain process is slower than light-speed
>>>> - but
>>>>>>>>>>>> then I'm basically a tropical fish realist. I'd have a bet
>>>> that no
>>>>>>>>>>>> one in this group would really have much of a definition of
>>>> light-
>>>>>>>>>>>> speed and the Ricel curvature tensor, Euler Langrangian and
>>>> the rest
>>>>>>>>>>>> of Einstein's field equations. I mean no offence and don't do
>>>> much
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>> this science myself.
>>>>>>>>>>>> If you point out to a physicist that the people from the
>>>> future who
>>>>>>>>>>>> have invented the time machine are in extraordinarily short
>>>> supply
>> ...
>>
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--
"I just flew in from the Land of the Dead
and boy are my arms tired."

--